How my shirt fit has changed in the past 15 years

Friday, August 30th 2024
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I know, a graph! Given the nerdery that’s often included on these pages, I’m surprised it’s taken so long for us to lead with a graph. (Mobile users: try opening the image in a new tab.)

Let me tell you what it shows. This plots my body and shirt measurements over time. I talked to all the shirtmakers I've used in the past 15 years and asked them for the body measurements they’ve taken, plus those of the finished shirts. 

On the graph you see the waist measurements plotted (in centimetres) along with the differential. The ones of my body (blue line) show how I changed over that period, with weight generally going up (noticeably during Covid) and some variations in exercise.

Those changes are not dramatic. I've never been a gym guy; I generally prefer activity that makes me healthier or is competitive and so (for me) more fun. But now and again injuries have affected things as well.

More importantly, the actual shirt measurements (orange line) and difference between the two (green) show how my shirts have become bigger by more than just those required for the changes in body shape. 

Why is this interesting? Because it proves numerically how my style has changed - towards slightly bigger, more comfortable shirts. 

I thought this was the case, but was never certain. I've asked for shirts to be bigger during fittings, but you never know how much of that is your body changing and how much is preference. So I thought it would be fun to analyse it. 

Luca Avitabile (below), who I’ve probably used the most, generally makes his shirts 10-12cm bigger in the waist than the body of the customer. That’s the amount of excess material. 

But as he says, that’s the starting point. It’s his job to assess how much space the customer wants - with questions, but also visual clues like how loose his existing clothes are, or how he acts when he’s wearing the fitting shirt. You have to dress the mind as well as the body.

The final excess could be 10cm or 18cm. It depends what look they want: how they want to feel and what style they’re after. I thought my preferred fit - my excess - had gradually increased over time, but wasn’t sure. 

In a way, this is also a graph that tracks fashion. A bit like industry data that used to show how the widths of ties or lapels vary - or more famously, women’s hemlines. A long-in-the-tooth tailor will tell you how they varied their lapels over the decades, but only from three to four inches as the fashion went from two to five.

Like those tailors, my changes have been moderate. My shirts were never super-tight, and today they’re not as loose as some either. In fact that's obvious: if the changes weren’t so subtle, you wouldn't need to use data to see them.

It’s interesting looking at brands too. Someone like Jake’s would do a waist of 114cm for my neck size, compared to the 107cm I have on my bespoke, even now at its biggest. Rubato does 116cm for its work shirts (below), which I always find a little blousy, whereas their ‘R’ shirts are 110cm, which is almost perfect. 

But, Simon 10 years ago would have even found those shirts too blousy. Because back then the data shows the excess I preferred was 10cm. Today it’s 16cm. 

The data is not perfect, because shirtmakers don’t remeasure you unless they feel they have to. It’s one of the advantages of bespoke shirts over suits. If a maker is reliable and your weight is consistent, you can simply order by looking at fabrics without needing a fitting. 

So in the past 15 years Luca has only measured me a handful of times. We don’t have the initially records either, back when he was Satriano Cinque. Fortunately a few other makers have filled in the gaps, though there are still some straight lines in there between some years. 

The other advantage of shirts is that they don’t necessarily last long enough for size changes to be an issue. I've had quite a few suits that have become too tight in the past 15 years (probably, in the same way, as a result of both changing size and preferences). 

But shirts haven’t been so bad. The issue is usually more that at some point I will contrive to spill something irreversible on a shirt, or catch it, or tear it. While I love fraying on some collars and cuffs, I’d rather not have it on dress shirts. 

One thing I can recommend is taking the darts out of your old shirts. It affects the waist more than the chest of course, and doesn’t help with the neck or sleeves. (Sleeves will often shorten as you’re upper body gets bigger - the muscles of the back and shoulders pull them up). 

But your waist is usually the area that needs the most help, and darts can add several centimetres - which, the data shows, is as much as my shirts have changed in the past six years, weight and preference combined. 

I don’t think there’s much reason for readers to go down a similar rabbit hole, but it is useful to have a rough idea of the measures you prefer in a shirt, to make buying online easier. I have an online note with a simple list of each, which gets referred to surprisingly often. 

Above, a bespoke shirt from Luca circa 2020. Feels a little tight now, but I know from the data that's more preference than it is body shape.

Thank you to all the shirtmakers that helped in the assembling of this piece - particularly given almost all of it seemed to be on paper in old ring binders!

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Stephen

Hi Simon,
Interesting to use data driven analysis. Plus i do love a graph!
Have a good weekend.

MR

Interesting thing is Simon is becoming more like the younger version of himself as he ages. A loose-fitting shirt is quite reminiscent of the 90s cool Britannia.

Stephen

Good point and one that applies (perhaps over a differing time cycle) to other creative industries. For example J J Abram’s Star Wars and Star Trek.

Alex

Does that mean Kula Shaker will be going back on Simon’s album rotation?

Bryan

Well, Oasis IS coming back…..

Aaron

I’m glad the trend is changing – I actually think a slight bit of blousing looks quite good, and a lot more natural than the straight-down totally flat look that a lot of other websites advised in favour for years ago.

Eric Michel

Very Interesting. I think my own graphs would be quite similar. And I have a view on what happened. Heidi Slimsne was the AD of Dior from 2000 to 2007. His impact was massive and he designed clothes which were very close to the body, really slim. Karl Lagerfeld decided to lose a lot of weight to be able to wear his suits… and many followed. Obviously tailors get inspired and everything became quite slimmer. Look at Bond suits, they became really slim at some point! And even if you believe you do not follow the fashion pack, you get influenced! Then over the last few years fashion brands have been moving to the opposite; look at the latest Saint-Laurent suits, they are all oversized… Then I noticed like you that over the last few years, I have asked for more room, for more comfort, not only for shirts, but for trousers, jackets, coats, for a more relaxed look! Bottom line, even if we are not fashionistas, anyone interested by his own style absorbs trends massively advertised by the multi billion fashion industry! We do not live on an desert island… and ultimately, it is hard to say if we follow or anticipate those global trends!

Kent

I have changed my diet over the last few months due to health issues. My consumption of carbohydrates and wine is much lower. My neck, chest and waist have slimmed by one to two sizes, i.e. they are back to where they were 15 to 20 years ago. Luckily, I kept the clothes in those sizes that now fit me again. There are over a dozen new Hilditch & Key shirts which were made in the old Glenrothes factory. They will be unwrapped and added to my wardrobe in the coming months. The diet’s savings on booze, buying new clothes or paying for more alterations will be considerable!

Alfred N

Congratulations, both on improving your diet and on being able to wear your old clothes!

Kent

Many thanks for your kind words but I must confess to missing the chablis, claret and champagne! Actually, a lot of the “old” clothes are as good as new as they were stored carefully. They demonstrate how the quality of several Jermyn Street brands has dropped significantly over the last decade or so. Luckily, I took advantage of multi-buy offers, promotions and sales so I don’t need anything now.

Stephen

Well done. Hope you enjoy them.

J.D

I think its difficult to achieve the perfect fit with a shirt due to shrinkage over time.

Kent

I’ve noticed that you now appear to prefer a looser fit for bespoke jackets too. Would you get better value for money from top quality MTM rather than full bespoke?

Amon

I think bigger shirts also look more flattering because they‘re more comfortable. And if you‘re comfortable, you look more at ease, which gives of a more confident impression. Plus I just do not like beeing „restricted“ by my clothing. I have a few mtm shirts with darts, which feel a bit tight now (has also to do with muscle gain). I hope they can let the darts out so I can gain a few centimeters!

Bob

Do love a graph, though would have made the difference to be markers at 5 to match the primary axis.

As someone who’s weight has change notably more than yours I wonder if its more than just preference? I know when I’ve been slim a shirt feels generally the same when standing or seated whereas when overweight a shirt often feels a bit loose standing but tight sitting.

I had somewhat assumed that the addition to the body measurement was a percentage rather than a nominal value

Paul

to be fair i’d have dropped the third line and just shaded the area between the charts, and added some vertical lines at certain points.
you can also then drop the axis and just have some key numbers put in start, middle and end of the chart lines.
and made it more colour blind friendly,
oh and put some pop-overs of pictures to illustrate the key measurement points.

Jakob W

As any nerdy follower of Bill Cleveland/Edward Tufte knows, readers are poor at estimating the difference between varying lines; the lack of a consistent baseline makes eyeballing the quantity difficult. If it’s an important value, I’d always plot the difference separately.

Craig

I also have gravitated towards a looser fit on clothing. This is one reason why I’ve moved away from Neapolitan tailoring. I feel like Neapolitan jackets are cut closer in both the chest and the stomach. They fit, they look good, but I don’t feel as comfortable in them as I do in the English drape cut or with Florentine tailoring. This may be due to small sample size on my part, of course.

Joe P

Love a bit of deep-dive menswear nerdery, Simon, very interesting. Your fit preferences as time goes by reflects my own – no doubt influenced by reading PS.

This article has made me wonder whether it will influence the measurements of the PS shirts in future. I find myself somewhat in between a medium and a large: I’ve a medium in the chambray (which fits, and I love, but is slimmer than I tend to go for nowadays) and large in a couple of Oxfords, which I’ve had darted: that plus the slight shrinkage works well, but leaves me unsure what I’d go for in a denim, which doesn’t shrink.

Alexander

I second that. RTW shirts in size 39 fit me relatively well from brands like 100 hands or Anglo Italian. But a medium from the PS shop is way too tight for me.
I cannot identify with the focus of the article and of the comments solely on waist size. To get more room in the chest, upper arm and shoulders was much more important to me lately.

Carl

Interesting!
Darts are a good invention. When I reached my top weight two to three years ago I took away darts in most of my shirts to make them bigger. I have now, as Ive lost a lot of weight, inserted darts again.
My problem with some of the shirts I bought when I was bigger is that it is hard to change the collar. You could move the button appr 1 cm but I would like to do more. So some of my shirts are actually hard to use at all.
Is there any solution to this problem other than replacing the collars (which costs approximately about the cost of a new shirt)?

Ollie E.

I came here for the graph haha.

If I could like others comments who said the same, I would!

CK

Nice Simon, timely as well as I was just thinking about Luca A last night. I visited him in London a few years back now, he took my measurements and made me 2 beautiful shirts – an Oxford and a denim shirt. It was amazing because I need a 16/16 1/2 collar and have relatively broad shoulders and chest but If I tried to buy a 16 or 16 1/2 off the rack, the arms would be too long most of the time. I’d happily have gone MTM as well but thought if I’m going to put the effort in I might as well go for it, plus Luca’s prices are reasonable and his shirts beautiful.

Looking back at the photo’s I took wearing them, everything still looks perfect, however I’d opt for just a little more room in the body now as well. I’m thinking I might set-up a video call with him at some point, if he still does those? I also have 2 cuts of PS Oxford shirt cloth that have been sitting in a box for a few years now.

I was sitting the other night and someone mentioned about going out to dinner at a nice restaurant and my head started turning as to what I’d wear. recently I’ve been buying work shirts exclusively (Bryceland’s, Rubato) and realised I need something a little sharper for occasions like that. I hear you on the width of the Rubato shirts but I quite like that. I just received a beautiful work shirt from them in an Indigo and cream check, only thing is it’s the heaviest cotton shirt I’ve ever felt, going to need a couple of washes to let it settle!

Dan

I notice a fuller/blousier shirt look works better with (at least) medium or higher rise trousers, as it gives a chance for the extra fabric to ‘billow up’.

david rl fan

Hi Simon, how you have written it

I’ve never been a gym guy; I generally prefer activity that makes me healthier or is competitive and so (for me) more fun.

Think you might be selling gyms and gym enthusiasts short on that especially considering the renaissance of natural bodybuilding that has happened over the last 4-5 years.

A quick search also shows that about 10-11 million people in the UK are gym members, a quite substantial amount indeed, however I do readily admit many parts of the culture are very damaging.

Took a bit of searching and remembering, https://www.mortsandmore.com, the only (not that I look) clothing company I’ve found with an emphasis on bodybuilding and classic tailoring. Sure the guys there would love a message from you. They are boasting clients like Simeon Panda and Premiership/England football legend Emile Heskey. Maybe an article in it too. I do realize I’ve gone very off-topic.

Christian

The issue I have with the quoted sentence is that gym training – which probably refers to weight training, in particular? – actually does make you healthier. (Good for cardiovascular health, reduces risk of injuries, helps keep body fat low etc., just to quote a few things from wikipedia…)
And you certainly don’t have to do “bodybuilding” or look like a bodybuilder to achieve that (probably on the contrary).

I think there are many misconceptions or negative stereotypes of weight training that are unfortunate, because it would have a real benefit for many people.

That being said, love the article, great insight! 🙂

Martins

I think the right answe about most things (weightlifting included) is “it depends”. Up to a certain point it’s most certainly healthy. After a certain point it becomes really unhealthy. Obsession, beat up joints, constant dehydration, etc, etc…

J Crewless

Personally, I’m glad roomier styles are returning. They’re more functional and easier to wear.

Luke

Simon, you’ve mentioned the impact of putting on weight and building a little muscle on the fit of clothes – have you ever considered changes to posture over time and how they affect your fit?

Mine’s changing (has to – it’s causing me pain as it is). I imagine yours has stayed pretty constant over time? Do tailors and shirt makers ever talk about it? I imagine it impacts how they cut shoulders, upper back and chest pieces quite a lot.

Jack Williams

Hi Simon,

A very interesting discussion. for the graph also follows our bodies’ aging process regardless of physique or weight. You should project the lines outward into your 60’s and 70’s to see what the future brings. An article about the way styles accommodate our expanding dimensions would be provocative – do our clothes, including bespoke, become fuller, to hide the sins of time? Should older men wear a different “cut” of jacket, shirt, or trousers? Are bandanas useful to disguise an older neck? The lines by T S Eliot, “I grow old, i grow old, i shall wear the bottoms of my trousers rolled…” suggests aging gracefully and certainly speaks to your comments after one has moved beyond the obvious ideas of fit and fashion.

Best
Jack Williams

Max Alexander

I have always felt that owning a boat is the best way to ensure a good income, and buying bespoke is the best way to maintain your weight. Yes, I could have my tailor adjust my clothes, but that would require suffering “la vergogna” as we say in Italy.

Georgios

This article arrived just about on time. Last year i got the ps white oxford and chambray clothes and made two shirts with Jake. The white came out really nice and got worn 6-7 times but will get be more use this year. The chambray one got worn 2 times and last week i cleared my wardrobe from stuff i don’t use. It took a lot of thought to understand why i don’t wear such a beautiful fabric with a good shirt design. I decided to make it a lot shorter since it was very long and could only be worn inside trousers and since i mostly wear jeans it always looked very sharp. Next week my local tailor will have it ready and then time will show if i wear that more. As we get older our preferences and size changes a bit but if someone stays in shape things will be much easier.

Paul Balcerak

I recently got a new job that required me to be in the office several days per week. I hadn’t really worn any of my sport coats during the pandemic — I was working from home for more than four years — and when I went to put them on, they were all super tight!

Cue me getting two new sport coats and realizing that I was no longer, in fact, a 44L.

Similar story with a lot of my shirts. Those super slim cut fits from the early to mid-2010s made me look like a professionally dressed sausage casing.

This is why you gotta wear your stuff! Find an excuse to throw on a sport coat at least once every few months. The sooner you notice your size changing, the better. Size increase isn’t necessarily a bad thing — gym gainz! — but you hate to find yourself in a situation where you need a new suit or a jacket at the last minute.

Jeldrik

Hi Simon,

what size would you take for the Rubato work shirt? Thanks.

JH

Love the graph and the effort to reproduce it! But without creating more forensic work for your shirt makers, isn’t the fullness of a shirt as much about the cut of the chest and shoulders in relation to the body as it is the waist? For example, I’ve very rarely found a RTW shirt uncomfortable due to the waist; if it’s too slim, it’s far more likely that the chest and shoulders are uncomfortably restrictive. And big ‘blousy’ shirts from, say, the 80s or early 90s look to be much fuller throughout, not just the waist

Jasper Smit

Funny timing.. I was trying on my winter/fall mtm Luxire shirts last week and realized they are too thight at the chest due to working out. What a shame, I love those shirts. Simon, you think removing the darts could make a difference or is that only for the waist a difference? I guess I could pass down these shirts to friends or later to my sons or something. Thanks!

And

I had a couple shirts which were noticeably tight in the upper back and actually opening up the darts fixed it. Maybe they had sewn the darts up too high?
That being said I do find it unlikely it would help if the problem was the chest.

Jack Williams

Very good Simon,

I wish I had you in one of my classes! Rebellion and a sense of individuality as one ages are the few ways of maintaining dignity and elegance as one grows old. But you are correct in that the poem does become more pessimistic as it develops.
Wonderful to have such a discussion with my style “Tutor.”

Jack Williams

Richard

Hiya Simon,
I have considered removing the darts from some of my shirts, the only thing that has stopped me is whether it would reveal a darker triangle of cloth which has been hidden by the dart (i.e. worn less that the rest of the shirt cloth).
Have you had any experience of this and if so any solution to it?