There are certain articles that arise from readers asking about a topic again and again. Or rather from the fact that when they ask, I don’t have an obvious place to point them to, so I have to repeat the same advice. This is one of these articles.
Suits are expensive, and always have been. These days a good one is even more expensive relatively, as it’s likely to be worn less.
Faced with this, it’s natural that a reader thinks, how can I get the most out of this suit? Maybe if I get one that I can wear as separates, I’ll wear it more and it will be worth the money. All I need to do is find the right material and style so the suit can be broken up.
The reasoning is understandable, but it’s fraught with danger. Most suit materials don’t make good jackets. As explained in the jackets section of our Guide to Cloth, suit materials are usually woven more densely to create a sharper look. That’s fine for trousers, but not usually for jackets.
A suit that can be broken up and worn separately - something I termed the ‘three-way suit’ a while ago - is possible. But usually only in quite specific materials, and those aren’t usually what our reasoning reader wants.
The easiest materials for a three-way suit are casual ones, particularly cottons.
Corduroy is fine, as a corduroy jacket would be made the same as a corduroy suit. Arguably a soft cord isn’t great for trousers and a stiff one doesn’t make a great jacket, but you can usually find a balance.
Smooth cottons like gabardine are usually fine too, like my Caliendo suit. Seersucker also. Design and structure matters, because my Suzuki cotton suit doesn’t work as a separate jacket, but it’s not too hard to get that right. I’ve given advice on this lower down.
Linen is a good option, because again a linen jacket and suit would be made from the same material. Associations often play a role here - we’re very used to seeing smart linen jackets and trousers, as well as suits.
The list of materials that don’t work is longer.
Fine worsted wools, like most suits use, don’t work because the density and smooth finish make the jacket look like part of a suit.
Flannel is better because it has more texture, but again it’s usually made to be a suit or trouser material and looks odd as a jacket on its own. Some softer flannels can be OK, but then the trousers are often a let down.
Tweed usually makes a better jacket - I made a suit out of tweed with the Anthology and the trousers don’t perform that well; you have to press them every couple of wears. The only tweeds that definitely work are the heavy, traditional shooting tweeds. They’re stiff enough to make good trousers, but then they’re not what everyone wants in a tweed jacket.
Wool/silk/linen mixes are the same, just in summer - they’re better for a jacket than a suit. As with many of these things, this is a specific mistake I’ve made myself - originally making trousers to go with this jacket.
The smart material that has the most potential is hopsack. This is usually a summer suiting, a weave of wool that is rather breathable and smart. The jacketing equivalent is usually mock leno or mesh, but hopsack can have enough texture to work for both.
I’ve seen this done well by a few people, one being Alex Natt, who talked in this interview about the hopsack suit he had made by The Anthology (shown below). The hopsack jacket I had made by Kathryn Sargent when she was at Gieves here could also have worked with matching trousers.
Associations help with navy hopsack, as a smart navy blazer is something we’re used to and it’s easy to get away with a little more sharpness. In a brown it wouldn’t be the same.
Alex's cloth was from Standeven, 27033. Mine from Kathryn Sargent was from Holland & Sherry but is no longer in production. They’re both a little coarser and more textured, and I’d avoid the smoother, more Italian versions such as those used for my Paolo Martorano jackets. They’re too soft for trousers.
The only downside of hopsack is that it’s mostly a summer cloth, so even in a heavier weight you’d struggle to wear it through a London winter, never mind a New York one. But it could stretch to three seasons in most places.
As mentioned, design and structure also help here.
A navy hopsack jacket in a softer structure - eg Neapolitan - is a little easier than a structured English one. Casual details like brown buttons rather than black help too, and you could go for patch pockets rather than flaps.
But there is a balance here, as the jacket still has to look like part of a suit when you wear the trousers with it. Some design elements would push things too far, such as gold buttons or very pale horn.
My personal choice would be a softer make, dark-brown buttons and flapped pockets. If you have any doubts, stay safe with the pockets and experiment with the buttons - the latter can be changed easily, the former can’t.
Most of time when I get asked about this topic, the commenter is just someone starting out - or just starting to invest money in their clothing. This means versatility is at a premium, but it also means they’re relatively inexperienced.
That’s why, in a two-sentence comment, I usually caution against a ‘three-way suit’. The risk is too high that they’ll end up with something that doesn’t quite work in any of the three ways. I’m not sure any of my tailoring ‘experiments’ (travel jackets, tweed waistcoats, embroidery) have really paid off in the long run.
But if they do want to go ahead, I’d push a reader towards hopsack or a casual material like corduroy or linen. And if anyone thinks they’ve had success with more cold-weather materials, please let us know.
Emilie Hawtin has also written well about this for women.
Those experiments:
Thank you, Simon!
I think, it would be helpful if you’d say a little bit more about trouser fabrics to combine with the suit jacket. Your pictures show corduroy worn with flannels and linen with linen. But could one combine linen with wool or cotton? And what about a cotton jacket? Would one wear it with cotton in another colour?
Hey Manuel,
Sure, I guess that’s a fairly wide topic to try and include in this piece as well, but I could do something different on it. There are also lots of outfits of mine in the Lookbook over the years in those combinations – you can filter by jackets. And if you look up articles on things like cotton or linen suits, you’ll find questions and answers about whether the jackets can be worn separately and what with.
Linen can certainly be worn with wool or cotton – if you look at the post here on my cream linen jacket, you’ll see options there.
And a cotton jacket, I’d only wear it with cotton trousers if the materials looked different enough to each other (same with linen and linen, which comes up a lot)
Hi Simon,
I, and I suspect others too, would appreciate more coverage of this topic. Despite how common these questions seem to be, there aren’t many good resources I’ve found as reference (e.g., this article on ‘spezzto’). Deeper dives focusing on cooler and warmer weather fabrics would make a great series.
Thanks Rob – I’ll work on something about materials that can be worn top and bottom with each other
The life of jackets is much longer than the life of trousers. I have broad legs so my problem is that I have bespoke jackets in grey pinstripe or grey prince of wales which are pretty new as opposed to the corresponding trousers which are completely worn out on the crotch. At a certain point I have started to have suits with two trousers but again after 20/25 years you have the same problem. Matching a pins stripe jacket it is extremely difficult. I realized that in a formal working environment (as it is in my case) dark blue jacket with dark grey flannel trousers is the best option to get the full life of a jacket.
If the suit is going to get a lot of wear, two trousers is certainly a good idea. And 25 years is pretty good for a suit that’s worn regularly I’d say! I’d destroy it or grow out of it in some way before then.
On matching fabrics, yes as a rule you should get the material at least at the same time as the jacket or suit, as colours can change slightly from one production to another.
“I’d destroy it or grow out of it in some way before then.”
Would love to know if there are any items you commissioned in the early years of PS that still get worn today – or wish you still had (if they are too small / taken a hammering).
May be one for a future post!
Hey NL, yeah there definitely are. I’ll plan something
Hi Petronio,
Excellent point.
This is where I like to wear separates, rather than a suit. If the trousers wear, a jacket should last longer.
I like my trousers in a fairly sturdy and durable fabric that will last longer and my advice, I beg to be corrected if I’m wrong, is seek a good tailor and ask for his advice!
Personally , I found what works to break up a suit is texture , (worsted as none so doesn’t work) , snd pockets .
Although seeing the advice pho to is I think better pockets can work . Previously I’d only mix and match on a jacket with patch pockets .
I think the main reason most men want to mix and match is to get the most wear out of the 2 (grey and blue) suits they get . But when those 2 suits are worsted it didn’t quite work .
So on that basis what cloth should be chosen for first blue and navy suits that can be worn in 3 out of 4 seasons ? Flannel ? Heavy hopsack ?
Yes you’re right Robin, and this is the core issue – very few smart-suit fabrics worn when broken up. A heavier hopsack is the only one I’ve seen work
I have a navy flannel suit that I occasionally wear as a separate jacket. It’s neopolitan construction with brown buttons so it’s that bit more relaxed although clearly quite smart still. I think there’s enough texture in the flannel to make it work but others may disagree.
I have found checked jackets can work pretty well as separates, as the checks often give a similar effect to texture. I’ve once made it work with a conservative Brioni in a dark blue tonal POW superfine, worn with similarly fine Zegna mid-grey trousers. Had to go full safe elsewhere (white solid shirt, navy tie, etc.). Was pleased as a result, will recreate and post a photo, perhaps try with light blue shirt. But the trousers of that suit cannot work I think as they are dark blue checks, and not even a navy so they cannot get away as dark navy could. Otherwise, I have a navy windowpane worsted flannel suit where the jacket easily works as a sportcoat. Trousers are useless as separates though.
If it’s any help, have a look at my MTM commission from Andrew Watson and the cloths used there in the “17 Made to Measure” tailors post although I’ll admit that a navy jacket in the Dugdale Mock Leno fabric and darker grey trousers in the H&S Airesco cloth might have worked better.
An all navy suit ensemble entirely in Airesco may have worked well also
It is the holy grail, and probably more so for those of us that are stretching ourselves. Linen was my closest to a success but in a tobacco brown I find for me it’s a bit OTT as a suit so almost always worn as separates. I’ve considered doing something similar in cord but concerned again on colour choice and how often it’d be worn as a suit.
It would be interesting to know the reason for the 360 on the Granata commission? In this post you state intending to have it as a suit was a mistake whereas in the original linked post you state it barely works as a seperate jacket and would have been much better as a suit.
Good point Bob. I think it’s a 180 though!
The jacket was OK as a jacket, but I think only just because it was a little shiny and luxe – more a case of the style not being quite what I was after (compared to say my Brioni fabric, which was less luxe looking) rather than it not being a good jacket.
Trouser material in that is just too light and flimsy I find, it doesn’t wear well and loses shape too.
Indeed 180, was responding to a “360 review” request at the time!
Out of curiosity is the too light/flimsy because your tastes have changed/ knowledge increased over time or that it was some level of misjudgement of the fabric when selecting it?
Misjudgement with the fabric. I think anyone would have felt after a few wears that the trousers were too delicate
Simon, this is very helpful. A technical question if I may. I had a gabardine suit made several years ago but it shrunk significantly the first time it was dry cleaned, rendering it unwearable. The dry cleaner blamed the tailor for not pre-washing the cloth (the tailor confirmed it wasn’t), but the tailor accused the dry cleaner of applying too much heat. This has put me off gabardine ever since, which is a shame because I found it a very useful formal/casual bridge. Do you have any advice?
Are we talking cotton gabardine or wool gabardine here James? Usually people mean the latter, but I’m guessing it might be the former given we talk about cotton suits in this piece
Cotton gabardine
In that case yes it can be nice, but I do think it’s a good idea for the tailor to wash it first. I’m not 100% sure but I think most would do
Many thanks Simon
I did forget to add that on my first commission from Steed I had a navy worsted suit made in HFW cloth BUT also another pair of dark grey trousers made in W. Bill Whipcord. I do like that combination!
Great article. The obvious conclusion in my mind is that someone starting out might consider buying a couple of good “one way” suits and minimizing spend on sport coats / odd jackets til later . In most major US cities in professional and social environments, the suits worn tieless (or with knits) will not seem more overdressed or affected than a sport coat. One sport coat in addition might cover situations where the suits just don’t work. I have a suit and traditional blue blazer made by W&S from the same worsted wool twill (their fabric code says HS 6021068). If I were going to try a suit where the jacket would also pass in the US as a traditional blue blazer, I might use that fabric and play with buttons and pockets as you suggest…although all your fabrics mentioned in the article are certainly going to bridge further to something that works as a true sport coat.
Simon Crompton wrote: “And if anyone thinks they’ve had success with more cold-weather materials, please let us know.”
I know Joseph Morgan has made what he calls a “blazer suit” of 20 oz cavalry twill in navy. It can be paired with cream trousers of the same material or with grey heavy whipcord trousers.
Thanks Burt.
I have a suit from Joe in that, and personally I wouldn’t wear the jacket separately
I had the same thing in mind. The cavalry twill jacket sounds like something that may be combined with odd cavalry twill trousers.
I have a vintage cavalry twill navy blazer from Turnbull & Asser. I love it, but I don’t think it pairs well at all with contrasting cavalry twill trousers. It has the same issue as pairing a worsted suit jacket with worsted suit trousers. I almost exclusively wear it with flannel trousers. The textures perfectly complement each other.
HI Simon,
I have read most of your pieces on the (odd) waistcoat, and wonder if you think this is something that can work today. In earlier articles, you argued that it is hard to pull off, and that the waistcoat has to fulfull some criteria in order to work: 1) same fabric as trousers and 2) conservative colors (and plain in color/no pattern).
Do you think that a made-to-measure waistcoat (as an alternative to sportscoat) is worth giving a shot to day? In my mind, criteria no.1 above makes it hard to pull off, because a wide range of trousers can fit the occasions where you would think that a sportscoat would fit
Personally Emil, no I don’t think it can really work that easily.
A waistcoat that is a different material to everything else – like the tweed one of mine shown – just feels too dandy and unusual for me. A workwear-type one that is looser and squarer is a lot easier.
And wearing a waistcoat and trousers together in the same material, as termed ‘the logical waistcoat theory’ years ago, is very elegant and practical but really has to be for a smart office where most others are in a suit and tie. Otherwise it’s too unusual. And that’s very few offices these days
ah ok thanks, this was really helpful.
Reading this it strikes me that, in many cases, the way of getting more versatility out of a suit is to change the other elements, rather than break up the suit itself (as you’ve covered in other posts). And I think something similar is probably true of jackets / trousers going in the other direction.
In other words when looking to tone down the formality of a suit it’s often better to wear it with a knit, a less formal shirt / shoes etc. That extends its scope (especially in some of the types of cloth you mention like linen or flannel). But doesn’t get into all the problems of breaking up the suit.
From the other direction, a jacket and trousers can be made pretty formal with a tie, formal shirt and shoes etc. These days there aren’t many circumstances where that kind of outfit wouldn’t be acceptable instead of a suit.
So, my two cents to anyone starting out would, I think, to go down that direction by getting either a suit you can ‘dress down’ or jacket and trousers you can ‘dress up’, rather than trying to get a suit you can break up. Especially as I think many of the options you’re suggesting might work have their own versatility issues (if you really need a suit in the workplace, I’m not sure a linen one is going to be appropriate).
Plus, for someone just starting out, I wonder if breaking up a suit is a bit of an advanced move. It’s the sort of thing that can work if you’ve got the right combination of good taste, confidence and knowledge. But difficult in their absence (and if it doesn’t work it probably ends up looking bad, in a way that say, being a little overdressed in a suit or underdressed in a still smart jacket doesn’t.)
When I first started reading more articles about clothes (before I even found PS) I read an article somewhere about hopsack being good for this. They referred to it as a ‘blazer suit’. This is definitely far more in depth and helpful than that article was. It’s definitely something I like the idea of, but as you say, not the most useful and I think I’d wear the jacket far more on its own than the trousers on their own.
Awesome and very helpful article Simon as always! It confirms in my mind what I’ve intuitively thought to myself for years: Heavier hopsack (around 12 ounces or more) with texture is perhaps the best material for someone who wants the most versatile navy suit possible in the long run.
In terms of materials that are along the same vein as more textured hopsack, are you familiar with Dormeuil’s Vintage Sportex cloth? What do you think about that one as one of the ideal materials for the three way navy suit?
I’m not I’m afraid Mike. I can do a fuller review of all the available cloths in this area and a separate piece on them if that might be useful
Very useful article and reinforces my view that a ‘three way suit’ wont work for me, much as I would like the financial benefit. Personally when I wear a suit I intend to be smart and therefore the materials I would choose wouldn’t work when broken up. If I tried to make a casual suit I don’t think I would ever actually wear it as a suit.
I agree with the article. I personally don’t like cotton as a material (for anything apart from shirts, jeans and underwear), so my go to material for a three-way suit is heavy flannel. I often end up wearing the flannel jacket from the suit with other flannel trousers of comparable weight in different colours. This means consistency in the material of the jacket and trousers while playing with the colours.
Thanks. Personally (for the clarity of others rather than disagreement with you S!) I find flannel jackets look too much like part of a suit, and they are designed usually as suits and trousers rather than jackets.
But there is some variation there, and heavier, coarser flannels are easier as they get more texture.
Personally I’d also want jackets and trousers that were in materials that were more different to each other – even something like a heavier, coarser flannel with a worsted flannel trouser
I am experienced. ( For my sins )
Materials :
I disagree a bit as regards tweeds but mostly notably in two specific categories : solid colour herringbone tweed and mid weight Donegal tweed.
Nothing with a check, the “stand alone” trousers never work.
Heavier linen
Hopsack great for jackets but in my opinion not great for standalone trousers.
Plain weave is great, in a variety of weights, colours, plies and degrees of roughness.
Cut / details :
Avoid excessively tailored ie better Ivy / US or Armani soft than classic British or French type tailoring
Be careful with flapless patch pockets. All the rage of late but can look cheap especially as a complete suit. I am not against them but exercise caution. 🙂
Agree to avoid fussy, cute detailing
CDBP is absolutely right about “excessively tailored” (and of course Simon touches on the same point about structure in the article). I have a beautiful navy hopsack suit, but it’s by Huntsman (and looks it from a mile away) so I’ve always found that the jacket is just too structured to work as a separate. Once upon a time this bothered me slightly, as I’d had in the back of my mind the notion of using it occasionally as a smart blazer in summer – however as I’ve worn the suit more and more, I’ve come to appreciate it for exactly what it is, and am glad now that I didn’t “compromise” (for want of a better word) in an effort to make it more versatile.
NB Many years later, I still haven’t got round to buying a navy hopsack blazer but seem to be managing just fine – there’s probably a lesson in there for me somewhere!
There is one further issue. Trousers usually have a shorter life than jackets, more wear and tear. Wearing trousers as separates might therefore be problematic.
See above Markus, that has been brought up already.
It’s certainly an issue, and a reason to have perhaps more than one pair of trousers
For me, three way suits aren’t practical. Basically, if you only want one suit for special occasions, get one that works as a suit. Because all the good fabrics for three way ones won’t usually cut it for the times when you actually need a suit, except perhaps linen.
Maybe three way suits work for someone who has a full closet of tailoring already, but I struggle to even wear my jackets. The idea looked extremely appealing a few years before, but by that point I don’t see how this could work for me.
Thanks for an interesting and highly useful post. Would your approval of hopsack in the three-way role extend also to fresco and other high-twists?
So, in general no, high-twists are made more for suiting and trousers most of time and I wouldn’t use Fresco certainly.
However it depends on the high twist, as you also get mock lenos and mesh made with the same or similar yarn, that is designed for jackets.
The issue is one of terminology, as ‘high twist’ just refers to the yarn, not the weave or the finish or anything else. Like most cloth terms, it’s a generalisation. Same with flannel, as noted above in a note to another reader. I believe Alex’s is actually a high-twist.
My advice normally stays on the safe side, as I don’t want readers to make any expensive mistakes. So I’d avoid high twists in general, but if you see one that is made up and you think works, do consider it.
Great; thanks
I have a dark grey Donegal suit that works as both a suit and a jacket, albeit it’s unusual enough that it wouldn’t be suited to someone who is after versatility. The fabric is sturdy and dense enough to work well as trousers (it holds a crease about as well as a flannel), and has enough visually going on with flecks of cream and red to work as a jacket. I would have to check with the MTM shop I bought it from but I think the fabric is from Magee.
Thanks Alan, yes those lighter tweeds can be good if they’re solid enough.
It only works with corduroy for me, I just buy more jackets those days and less suits. In navy for example, I have suits and blazers, never wear a suit jacket alone, Wool can be the same for a suit and a blazer, but the gold or silver buttons change everything! Compared to 10 years ago, I need half the suits, then I have invested in a very limited number of great suits, and then I buy jackets…
I really appreciate how you break things down and demystify them! I’ve sort of struggled with this question myself and I could never figure out why the worsted wool suit jackets would never look right as a stand alone jacket.
Oh good, lovely to hear Usman
If someone is starting out and wanting to make a suit more versatile I think it’s better t think about all the ways you can wear the suit more casually rather that trying to break the suit up.
More casual suits, like corduroy, don’t really work in more formal settings so they can be less versatile if you are only going to have two or three suits.
It seems to me the trick is to have a suit in a basic colour (navy, mid grey) in a fabric that isn’t to fine (hopsack maybe) and experiment with ways to wear it casually. I like wearing polo shirts with suits as a way to dress them down. Other knits and denim and chambray shirts are other ways to do this.
Those of a certain vintage (me) and professional sector (me) may recall the very early ‘00s trend in London media executive circles to wear a single breasted tailored suit jacket with boot cut jeans and a t-shirt. Often with a “Hoxton fin” hairstyle (also: me).
to continue the discource on black, how feasible do you think a black cord or black linen suit would fare as a three way suit? I know you’ve covered your cord suit before but I can’t recall if you wrote about breaking it up. I quite like the way The Anthology styled their double breasted black cord jacket. Of course, it being a DB makes it more showy, but I think the ethos of the styling is still really well done. I can imagine it’d be less possible with a black linen suit, as the trousers would be significantly more wearable than the jacket. Curious to know what you think.
I think both could be broken up well, but they would be more striking looks that took more careful thought.
Actually, I think that Anthology DB in the black was great and easier to wear than my slightly wider-wale and so slightly shinier one
1. Great to know your take! I think in the grand scheme of the landscape, a mostly black tailored outfit in casual materials like these might run pretty incognito in NYC, you know? There are far more people wearing far more peculiar outfits… How do you think you’d pair a black linen jacket though? Seems a lot easier in cord.
2. The whole FW23 “Pitch Black” collection from them was just great. It aligns really well with how I like to wear clothes and the colors I enjoy, so it was a great source of inspiration. I seriously recommend going through their seasonal lookbooks for everyone to just get a refreshing take on tailoring or spark some new ideas.
1. Yes I can see that, and black linen would be interesting. I think the same kind of colours as my black tweed, or even an all black look as you say
Hi Simon, I just wanted your take on a potential fabric for a three way suit. I was at The Armoury discussing a model 103 commission, and speaking to Alex and Stephon, they recommended Drapers 6-ply for a fabric that could be broken up in a pinch. In a non-formal color like dark brown, how do you think that would fare?
Personally, I think it’s on the edge as to whether the jacket would look like part of a suit. The high-twist does give it texture, and in a casual make with sharp trousers, it might be good. But it would be a risk and I’d like to see something made up before I committed, myself
Agree with everything here through hard-earned experience….but dang, it does make our hobby more expensive……
Hi Simon – good timing on this as I am currently considering my first ‘three way suit’ for Spring/Summer. It’s a little more of an unorthodox cloth choice, but I would love your opinion. It’s a tan/beige coloured Wool Seersucker (290g, Delfino).
It would have all the hallmarks of a Sport Coat (very soft shoulder, patch pockets, contrasting buttons. Does your instinct (understandably, without seeing the cloth in person) feel like this could work? I would probably look to wear it with off-white cotton/linen and brown high twist trousers. When not worn as a suit, it would always be without a tie. Perhaps lightweight denim shirts, or one-piece collars.
I’m a little nervous Jonny as I’ve never seen that kind of colour made up as seersucker. Also I find tans like that depend a lot on the particular shade. If it’s a little too warm or too strong it can be hard to wear.
If I’m honest I would only go for that if I’d seen it made up already
Are you going to update the excellent suit breakdown series anytime soon? It’s fascinating comparing what you were wearing 5 plus years ago to what you wear now. Case in point that amazing Suzuki suit you reference in the article compared to the recent JMeuser suit for example.
We can do some more next year, yes, though I was also thinking of doing one around the MTM suits we’ve done
I love the mention of tweed, I think my only “three way suit” (or possibly four way as it is a three piece, lol) is my Harris Tweed, it does lend itself to versatility.
One thing I am interested in is the idea of a worsted navy suit. I have never done it, nor have I ever recommended it. But my current navy blazer got me curious. It’s a Zegna 10 pocket, “High Performance Wool” collection. It’s high twist, I believe 2-warp & 2-weft, designed to be worn and bounce back easily. The blazer works perfectly as intended, but I can’t help but think that if I had a pair of pants in the same material not only would they work fantastically as a pair of pants, but it would look correct as a suit. Especially as the cut is a bit softer, I never felt the jacket looked too formal or too informal.
Why wouldn’t something like this work?
Thank you.
It could potentially Brian, it sounds like that could fall into the kind of high-twists we talk about in the comments above – some like a mock leno or mesh are made more for jackets and look good like that. The soft make obviously helps as well
Very interesting article. Three way suits have been great for me, but then my everyday is in very informal environments and just wearing a jacket means you’re often on top of the game. I found a navy corduroy sb suit in a quite heavy material that works great as a suit and great as separates. I think this is the most successful one. Today I’m wearing the jacket with a pale yellow oxford shirt and vintage Levi’s 505 in a light blue shade, but it looks great with eg brown flannel trousers as well.
Then I have a navy linen sb suit where the jacket works wonderfully and the trousers … okay. The trousers are fine as to the material but they’re a bit formal for me to wear them regularly as separates.
Finally I’ve quite recently bought a brown almost maroon-ish cotton db suit. I’m starting to find out how to use it but it’s growing more and more on me. I had to narrow the trouser width at the feet but then the trousers will be great, and the jacket will work well with chinos and a couple of different jeans.
Something touched upon but maybe not said outright is that anything that works as a three-way suit is probably not going to be that useful for people who look for a three-way suit!
As you write, Simon, the three-way is especially appealing for people getting into tailoring, as it seems to offer more ways to wear for your bucks. But a cord suit doesn’t really work in most situations where you’re expected to wear a suit. Same with smooth cotton. It will get you nods of approval from the #menswear crowd, but if you wear one for an interview at a conservative company (or to meet your strict inlaws-to-be for the first time) you’ll risk looking like a fool. Linen is easier during the summer, but it also tends to look better in informal colors. I adore tobacco linen, but it’s not very suitable for formal affairs. So while some of these three-way suits may work three ways, they won’t really fit the use case that most people new to tailoring have when they need a suit!
Navy hopsack is indeed likely to be the best choice, even though navy trousers aren’t quite as versatile as one might prefer.
Yes, good point Sam
I especially like the tip about the tweed. My three piece tweed suit in a Harris Tweed is probably the only suit that I break up and wear as a “three-way suit” (or is it four-way due to the waistcoat, lol).
However, I have recently wondered if my navy blazer would work well as a suit. It’s a Zegna 10 pocket in their “High Performance” wool. This is a high twist, I believe 2-warp & 2-weft, worsted wool designed to be worn and bounce back quickly. The jacket works great as a blazer, never too formal or informal. I have a few pairs of their High Performance wool pants in other colors and can’t help but wonder if it were the same fabric, why it wouldn’t function nicely as a suit. The jacket is a soft shoulder, 2 button, flap pocket, just like many of my suits, so why shouldn’t it work?
Hey Brian – I see you’ve left the comment twice. Don’t worry if your comment doesn’t immediately appear, it’s just because I moderate and publish everything, so there can be a bit of a delay
Sorry, it was an odd Friday. I forgot that I posted it the first time, lol.
Thank you for collecting all of this information in one thread. I have probably read all the articles about it on PS, but is great to get all the information here together with all the comments from other users!
I am one of those that have been intrigued by the idea, and have some thoughts about some of the issues, some of them mentioned previously in the comments:
First, that trousers wear faster. It is possible to get two trousers with the suit, but if so why not just buy separate trousers, and a suit, ideally one where the jacket can be used separately, a two-way suit?
Second, I think it is important to be aware of how it fits in the overall wardrobe. If you work somewhere where it is still common to wear a suit, you are probably better of going with a regular suit first, and dress it down with knits, casuals shirts etc instead. If going the other way, like me, in an office where no one wears a suit (or jacket) it is better to start of the wardrobe with some separate pieces. Two different ways to approach the three-way suit, but the common is that even though it is intriguing as a starter piece it should probably first be added to the wardrobe a bit down the road when you have the experience to make the right decisions.
One place I think a three-way suit can be helpful is as Asa travel capsule, as shown in the Emilie article and in your summer capsule article. It can then be the centrepiece of the travel wardrobe, and the other pieces selected to match.
I also think it is helpful to think of a three-way suit, by having to serve so many uses, as a compromise, which in many ways are fine, but making a compromise is perhaps not what one would look for when getting a bespoke suit. Is that part of the issue here?
I remember you were going to test out wearing your Fox flannel navy chalk stripe suit as separates. How did that go? Is you asking us readers to comment about cold weather alternatives indicative that it didn’t really work out?
Good point on the chalkstripe Kristian. I’ve found I can wear it, but it’s quite a showy thing, more fashion and less everyday. Also the trousers aren’t that useful on their own
I note that despite the title “Three-Way Suit,” the examples are really more two-way, i.e., the suit and the jacket as a blazer or sport coat. That’s certainly my experience as well. I often travel with only a mid weight navy suit, grey dress trousers, and jeans. And while I agree, in concept, that worsted wool is the least good choice for mix and match, I find it works perfectly fine with the worsted wool dress trouser and acceptably in a pinch with dark lighter weight denim jeans. Adding or subtracting a necktie, I can travel light and still have various combinations running from reasonably formal to smart casual. It’s actually the suit trousers I’ve found not particularly adaptable. With a dress shirt or fine gauge knitwear, it looks like you either forgot your jacket or just took it off. With heavier knit or, say, a dressed down untucked Oxford shirt, it just looks wrong.
Sorry Mark, no they are three way – the trousers from the cotton, or corduroy, or linen could also be worn on their own?
Thanks for a great article! A thought: The classic blazer and trouser combination is usually based on the idea that the top and bottom pieces have roughly the same level of formality. If you break that rule and go for a high/low mix instead (like Ralph Lauren, for example), I find that more suit jackets can actually work as odd jackets. For instance, a chalk-stripe jacket can pair well with jeans (your beautiful brown one from Fred Nieddu would probably look great with black jeans?). A grey flannel jacket works with raw denim, and so on. Of course, this demands a lot from both the wearer and the garments. And the suit trousers don’t get used, but at least I’ve found it to be a way to get more use out of my existing suit jackets.
I think you’re right Per, if we’re pushing into more fashion territory, or showier things. Where contrast and unlikely combinations can be welcomed.
My Nieddu is a bit too structured to work with jeans I find, but the material could be nice in that more fashion way, yes. I’m still not so sure about flannel, and some things would still not work, like a regular worsted suit jacket
Yes, you’re right—it’s more fashion/showier. But I think these combinations are great inspiration, even if worsted is probably a lost cause. You’re also right that the cut is important—I have a few suits from Saman Amel where I sometimes wear the jacket with jeans (it helps if the jeans have a slightly higher rise, like Rubato) when I’m going to an event or setting—such as a gallery—where the atmosphere is more fashion-oriented.
Speaking of versatility, I find chalk-stripe (which I actually bought inspired by the combinations you’ve shown) incredibly useful these days. It can be dressed up to the nines, but also dressed down, and it moves seamlessly from traditional to more fashion-forward looks. A lot of joy in pieces like that!
Agree, thanks Per
I think a key thing here is to remember that this REALLY demands a lot from the wearer. Most people who are into tailoring don’t do fashion well. Ralph has a serious halo effect going on, as a “living saint” of menswear. Most of us will look like a middle manager who wore out the trousers of his one good suit, and is now trying to salvage it by wearing it with jeans. Or a sales-bro. The business mullet look is never far away.
In my (highly personal) opinion, people who have a bit of a punky/rebellious style are usually the best at pulling off this look. Wearing a (formal) jacket with denim looks much better if it looks like you just threw on whatever was around, than if it looks like you’re trying to actively dress down your #classicmenswear.
Yes, agree Sam
I’ve got some examples myself that have worked for me.
For worsted suit separates, I’ve found nothing beats the good old navy/charcoal combo. I’ve got a navy suit here that works perfectly with charcoal trousers in a similarly fine fabric; it basically looks like a more business-like version of the charcoal flannel / navy blazer combo. I’ve got a pair of pretty smooth mid-grey trousers that work really well with the jacket from another navy suit I have that’s similarly smoother than the rest of my suits.
I can confirm that heavy tweeds work well. I’ve got a thrifted tweed suit here (well – pseudo tweed, woven in England, not Scotland, but tweed for all intents and purposes) that’s pretty thick, and while the cloth is so extremely thick, it’s more of a bend than a crease, the trousers work well with many sport coats I have and the jacket works as a sport coat itself.
For flannel jackets, I have to protest. I’ve got a few, all vintage thrift store finds, and I find them quite useful and versatile. One in particular comes to mind, mid-grey wool, that pairs beautifully with a pair of charcoal worsted separate trousers (bit rougher weave than suit trousers) without looking overly incongruous, at least not more than i.e. tweed and jeans.
Sport suits / casual suits in general work really well in my experience. Brown flannel suit, mid-grey glen check suit, that sort of thing can be broken up easily. The trousers from the brown flannel suit work for pretty much all autumn/winter sport coats I own, for instance (even though I would caution against wearing trousers separately; they wear out even faster that way and you’ll be left with an orphaned suit jacket…)
Great article and a fascinating topic. I think the three-way suit proper (wearable as all of a jacket, trousers and a suit) is a truly rare species, probably confined to linens and corduroys and then only in a very few specific colors. I followed your example and had a cream-linen suit made, which I wear frequently in all three modes in the summertime, and which is hampered in its versatility only by the fact that I had the trousers made to be worn with braces rather than with a belt, which would have made it easier to wear them without a jacket. I still do that, but it requires things like hiding the braces underneath a dark guayabera.
Very few other things probably work the same way, though, since most odd-trouser materials would be strange as odd jackets, and most colors are similar — as the comments on this article attest, brown jackets are a harder sell than brown trousers. I think maybe a more useful way to think about trying to maximize versatility, if you are someone who mostly wears odd jackets and trousers, is considering to have certain jackets made as suits. I have a vintage black cord jacket that I wear frequently, for example, which I think could be very good for evening wear also if I had matching trousers, but I don’t think I would ever end up wearing black cord trousers without the jacket. Maybe one could call this a two-way suit?
Yes, true Milton. I think black cord could look nice on its own – I guess it’s more about your style in that case rather than what can or can’t work
I admit I’ve not given a lot of thought to breaking up a suit because I’ve used worsted wool for them, and I haven’t actively considered a fabric like corduroy for a suit (or linen, but that’s because I don’t like it). Interesting thought experiment, though.
i completely agree with this. I think about this not for the sake of mixing and matching pieces but for being able to use one of half of a suit if or when the other half of it wears out. The best cloths for suits, jackets and trousers rarely all line up, as you point out. I end up purchasing fewer suits and more jackets and trousers because of this, but also because I don’t need many suits. Trying to find this versatility isn’t going to serve most people the way they hope it will.
I’d say that medium weight herringbone tweeds make for a great option as a three way suit, so long as you don’t mind having a suit with a rather loud character. This isn’t something I’d recommend as a first or second suit, but if you enjoy wearing suits and tailoring then a gray or deep green herringbone tweeds is a beautiful thing. A Green herringbone suit, Donegal wool usually, with a mustard or cumin Shetland is a personal favorite of mine in the fall.
Hello,
Yes a very familiair subject. I remember when I got into tailoring I thought hours and hours about what suit to pick to be able to make it work with chinos or a different suit. Now 8 years later I mostly wear jeans and a crew neck or t shirt. I feel so much more free not having to think so hard about clothing anymore..
My conclusion, wear a full suit if you have to. A navy or gray.. That’s it.
This article comes at the right time since I‘ve in the market for my first proper suit this year. Will be MTM because budget is a concern.
And of course I want to get the most out of it!
I‘ve been thinking of a dark navy cotton suit, probably made up from Solbiati fabric.
Style-wise would be notch-lapels, maybe a slightly lower buttoning point (I like the Anglo-Italian look), single pleated trousers with belt loops with a higher rise, no cufffs. My biggest problem is the pocket-question. I would like patch pockets as I think they would make the jacket better on it‘s own, but at the same time it highly depends on the shape and execution of them in terms of their look…
Flaps just seems much safer. I imagine the jacket working well with some smarter chinos like Rubatos. The trousers should be easy on their own.
With the second comission in the mind (a mid-grey flannel from fox brothers) I think this two-suit wardrobe would be good as both trousers would work on their own and at least one jacket as well. If I would do another fox flannel trouser in a darker shade from the same bunch, maybe it would also work with the mid grey jacket… either way, a lot of food for thought!
I think they sound like good choices Amon, I would just say that you should make sure you would like the navy cotton suit as a suit, just as much. Because you might not find you like it as a separate jacket as much. Certainly with other cotton trousers
Thanks Simon.
And on that Cotton Suit, I‘m with you there. First and for most it‘s a suit. The Jacket on it‘s own is more of a side effect to loosen things up from time to time. I will have it made up so that it works as a suit in the first place!
Simon I’m a bit surprised about the lack of mention for Minnis Fresco. It’s certainly seasonally limited (although these days runs three seasons in a lot more places than it used to). But it’s a common fabric for men commissioning both jackets and suits, and some colors like 0520 RAF blue are quite versatile.
Fresco is more of a suiting/trouser material Justin. It is sharper than, say, a mock leno, mesh, hopsack, which are usually better for jackets
I have found that a heavy black cavalry twill can be very versatile. As a jacket, with jeans or light grey trousers; as a trouser, alone or with cold tone jackets; and as a suit, a fairly sharp ensemble. The cloth is heavy and durable enough to not look overly dressy, but sharp enough to work as a suit.
I agree worsted wool is not the best option if the intent is to pair the jacket with other trousers, but to my eye a heavier charcoal worsted wool works perfectly well as trousers, so the bottom half of that kind of suit can be worn as a separate fine.
True, more a two-way suit in that regard. Bear in mind what we talked about on this article though – you want heavier, coarser worsteds if you can. Otherwise finer, shiny ones can look a little like just part of a suit
I stop into a local thrift store to have a look around. I see multitudes of suit jackets.and blazers all lined up together on one long rack. It is obvious to me the differences in the suit fabrics. I do not get any grand ideas about purchasing a suit jacket that has no trousers. When I want to wear separates, I wear a Camelhair blazer with contrasting wool trousers. My navy wool blazer has brass buttons. That requires contrasting trousers in wool or linen. When I want a monochromatic look, I wear a linen blazer with linen trousers. The colors need not exactly match. If they do match, I then have a linen suit.
The problem with “this” question is that many who are new into menswear wants a short cut (no criticism of them, been there and done that myself). You want your neat business suit formal meetings, funerals and weddings and you want to be able to use the same jacket and trousers for other circumstances. That will almost never be possible as a dark grey or navy suit in worsted wool never work as separates.
There are cloth that work but as both a suit and separates. But we are then no longer in “business suit” territory but in more unusual materials and maybe also colors. And by the time you buy that (if you do it right) you already have more than a couple of suits, odd trousers and jackets. In short. The suit that works as separables are never going to be among your 2-3 first suits (if you buy suits that works for formal meetings and most other formal occasions.)
The one made by J. M. Moreau stands up by far. Or it’s just me
A reminder – if you have a “suit” that you wish to also wear as a break up – be sure the two parts go to the cleaner together. There is subtle color change in that process that will be apparent and unattractive .
I agree either way your assessment. I think to stretch the value, a Three-Season suit would be better than the Three-Way suit.
I would find a Three-Season cloth article/guide helpful, especially if you could pair a selection of cloths for each of a few different geographies. Hopefully that could provide enough information for the reader to extrapolate for their local or intended climate.
And if you could clarify what the three seasons are, that would be excellent as well. I’d postulate a more tropical climate it could be Autumn, Winter, Spring where the very hot summers would need to be addressed with a different cloth. And in a climate with a harsher winter and mild summer, it would be Spring, Summer, Autumn.
Nice point Ben, yes that would make sense
Hey Simon! I just wanted to ask if you had any plans to update your wedding guide, or has your perspective not really shifted since you’ve last updated it. I have a close friend’s wedding coming up near the end of August, and I was thinking about what kind of suit I’d want to get, as it would be my first one. The idea of a three-way suit was appealing due to all the reasons described in the article, but of course the same challenges apply. I wouldn’t really wear this suit that much outside of events, just due to the nature of my office and lifestyle (the most formal dress I’d ever require is a jacket and a pair of trousers.) Should I go for either:
a. A simple navy/grey worsted suit that would be applicable to most dressed up/formal events and only wear it as a suit
b. A navy heavy hopsack suit with the intention of wearing the jacket on it’s own
c. A wedding-oriented suit such as a DB/light grey that would only be applicable for warm weather daytime events, and just commission the most versatile suits later.
There is no strict dress code, or much of any guidance from my friend/host, so the ball is pretty much in my court.
Hey,
I’d say (a), or (b) if you’re absolutely confident of the commission, because you’ve seen an example of what you want already made up
Good points in the article, Simon! It’s a nice idea, but tough to execute.
Fully agree on navy hopsack being the best for a true 3-way which is wearable across seasons and thereby truly versatile, and linens and cottons for warmer weather.
Another warm weather that I had made work is a mix (wool silk or plus linen) in a small pattern and conservative colour common in both suits and trousers – a glencheck/POW or houndstooth in mid to light grey and browns. Also for summer a brown summer wool (marled texture etc.) or mix would also work, I’ve recently seen an Eidos number of this nature.
I suspect similar would work in winter – flannelish small check or POW in mid to light grey and brown. However, I don’t have first hand experience.
Hi Simon,
Do you have any thoughts on Harrisons Indigo bunch as a candidate for a three way suit?
I haven’t looked at it for a while John, but if I remember correctly it’s more towards the suit side of things, not so good for a jacket. I’d have to look again though
What about high twist bunches like Fox Air and Fox City for summer-3-ways? There are obvious jacketings (Madras, Gun Clubs), and there are obvious suitings. But aren’t there some choices that might be wearable as suits and as jackets like the stripes?
Generally no, those high-twists are better as suits. High twists that are better for jackets are usually separate – mesh, mock leno