Rayon shirts, and tucking in or out 

Monday, August 1st 2022
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I’ve been interested in rayon shirts recently, perhaps as I’ve been dressing a bit more casually and would like an alternative to linen.

However, I’ve found it hard to find the perfect model. Usually the collar is the issue - this is a retro material, and the shirts often come with retro styling, which means wider collars. 

This can look great on larger men or those with larger features - like Ethan at Bryceland's for example. And they work well if that’s more your overall style I think, as it is for Scott Simpson.

But for a guy looking for a more subtle, everyday style, they can be a bit much. I’d love a Bryceland's rayon but I’ve tried them a few times over the years only to reinforce this conclusion. 

It was nice, therefore, to find the rayon shirt pictured from Pherrow’s, sold at Clutch Cafe. 

It has a smaller collar - the kind of thing a shirtmaker might cut as his default camp collar. To put it in numbers, it measures 7cm to the point, compared to 10cm for the Bryceland's. 

It’s also possible for collars to be too small, at least for me. This seems to largely happen with mainstream shirts, which I guess shouldn’t be surprising given their button-down collars and jacket lapels are so small. 

But I also have an old Gitman Bros camp-collar shirt from Trunk that has a 5cm collar. I end up undoing more buttons and rolling the fronts open, to try and increase the size. 

It’s worth emphasising that - as with everything we discuss - the point here is not to just follow someone’s preferences or dimensions - mine or anyone else’s. Rather, it is to understand another's preferences and then consider whether they apply to you. They may not.

Featuring this rayon shirt brings up some other issues readers have asked about. Let’s try and deal with one of them: tucking in and out. 

In very hot weather - as many of us have experienced in recent weeks - it can be much cooler to wear a shirt untucked. Air flow makes a difference. 

But a tucked-in shirt is usually more flattering, and certainly more elegant. It gives you a clean line at the waist and it makes the upper body look wider. It also lengthens the legs and brings attention to a nicely cut trouser. 

For those reasons, and because elegance is always at the back of my mind (no matter what I’m wearing), I will wear a rayon shirt like this tucked in most of the time. 

I’d also encourage others to try it. It might not be the intuitive thing to do, but try tucking a short-sleeved shirt into a pair of good linen trousers - they don't have to be expensive, just with a nice line, length and colour. 

Still I will wear a shirt like this untucked, and it’s more natural to do so with one that has short sleeves and a square hem. 

That's the question readers usually ask: when would you wear a shirt untucked?

With a shirt like this, but I'd also be more likely to do so with a long-sleeved one that had a square hem, and would do so last of all with something that was long-sleeved with a regular hem (a normal shirt, basically). 

Untucking a regular shirt can look good, and I recommended a linen shirt like that from A&S recently. But it takes a little more consideration to make sure it doesn’t look like you’ve just untucked your office poplin. 

If you're going to do that then having a square, blowsy cut helps; as does a soft collar and cuffs; unbuttoning it more to create shape is nice; also wearing something close-fitted underneath, like a vest; and sticking with casual, open-weave materials.

It's no coincidence that the same kinds of things apply to overshirts - they're usually looser and softer in the same way. 

The other subject short-sleeved shirts can bring up is bold patterns - Aloha shirts and the like. 

Two kinds really turn me off - the ‘fun’ type (Snoopy surfing anyone?) and the ones with that kind of dense pattern that reminds me of English men like Noel Edmonds

Actually, it’s unfair to lump this on Noel. The English middle-aged male generally is guilty of wearing ‘party’ shirts that have close Liberty-like patterns, presumably because it’s an obvious way to show that this is not an office shirt. 

But patterns more broadly are probably best left for another day. For the moment I'm sticking with love this plain ‘black’ from Pherrow’s, which is actually an inky navy. Following its success I bought the ‘natural’ - a kind of sand - but that benefits from something white underneath, like a vest, otherwise it rather washes me out. Always a risk with creams and related colours. 

The shoes are Edward Green unlined Belgravias, in black suede. The trousers are brown linen, from this Sexton suit. The bag is my old old Frank Clegg working tote. If anyone has any questions on the shirt - fit, feel, material etc - do ask in the comments. 

Photography: Alex Natt

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Great timing on the article as I am currently looking for a short sleeve camp collar loose cut straight hem shirt.
I have a question regarding the cloth : what exactly is rayon ? Is it always cotton ? Do you feel ‘sweaty’ as in polyester ? What is the feel, texture like ?


Rayon is not a synthetic fabric (made from synthetic polimers), but a semi synthetic, made from cellulose fibers (basically wood pulp, like paper). In most European countries it is also called viscose. Because it’s made of natural materials, it does breathe. The diadvatntage is that it wrinkles like crazy. It is sometimes called a cheaper alternative to silk, although it usually does not have the same sheen.


How would you compare this shirt to an equivalent in 100% cotton or linen? I don’t really like viscose, but like this style of shirt


It can also go by the brand name Tencel


If there is a difference, i think it is in the source of the cellulose (bamboo, beech, etc), bit as you say, not a big difference in the final spun cellulose fabric

I have to say that i love rayon fabrics for casual hot weather shirts, but i also struggle to find a collar i like. Certainly RTW


Hi Simon,
Really not sure on this.
I am not a fan of synthetics at any time, they do not breathe, I remember Bri-Nylon. I note you wear a layer underneath possibly to counter the lack of wicking.
The cut seems to be too boxy, coupled with the drape of the material hides the waist.
You are relatively slim yet your waist is destroyed the bunching when tucked in gives a spare tyre, when out it is totally bereft of shape.
I have a 46in chest the boxy cut would give me a 46in waist, when it is 36-38in.
There must be a style you are trying to achieve, latino? But I do not see tailoring nor quality materials.
Sorry it is a No from Me.


I’ve bought some tencel/linen blend shirts recently and I really like the feel and drape . . . as well as the cooling properties.


Hi Simon – what I have wondered is what exactly is rayon? Is it natural or man-made? How does it wash etc? Best wishes, Rob


Good morning,
thats exactly what i mean as an elegant, classic mens summer style! A few linen trousers, cotton short sleeved shirts and tassel loafers. Of course plain colored shirts, always tucked in!! Maybe some stripes, but thats about it. And that camp collar.. how flattering. The white underwear t-shirt detail, that women love to hate!!
well… very nice beggining for the 1st day of the month
I wish a cool, restful August

Peter Hall

Do you think the v of the collar opening should frame the width of the face? This shirt does and it looks very well balance.


As an additional point if your short then tucked in will definitely make you appear taller.
Just a thought but why not add pleats to the back of that shirt , give it shape, without it becoming too restricted ?
I’m actually looking at buying linen shirts at the moment and ,whilst the Cordings ones are a very good cloth , wondering whether to wear them as they come (loose and baggy) or altered with pleats .


Sorry, no not a box pleat but two darts to give it a bit of shape thru the waist .

I’m so used to tailored clothes on this site that anything boxy seems odd.


Hi Robin,
I had a Cordings linen shirt some time back; they are quite generous in width & length. I had mine slimmed, shortened with a straight bottom & two side vents & changed the collar to be smaller & less stiff. Now I wear it more often.


First to say Yea ? I myself was toiling with this shirt style and how could I possibly fit it in my wardrobe. But I realised it’s not I will enjoy wearing (who knows I might if I did it well), but not my thing for now. It’s gives me clarity after reading your thoughts on this type of shirt and styling. Thanks Simon.


I suggest buying a cheap one on eBay and try it out to see if you like the style


Very simple and elegant. I actually really like the blousy-ness when tucked in, I think it’s a nice contrast with the trouser waistband but still feels relaxed. I do like the contrast with the vest underneath – I prefer it to the ‘sleazecore’ look of unbuttoned shirt and vest (though I can certainly appreciate the practicality on a particularly hot day or on the beach).
Is the pocket strong enough to hold a pair of sunglasses?


Wow. Rayon is never a material I would have associated with Permanent Style; nor would one have thought the words ‘elegant’ and ‘rayon’ could be used in the same sentence.
I suppose I must reconsider.


Why not? Bemberg is used in almost all tailored jacket linings and it is a type of rayon.


Really nice. I found one for myself, but it’s viscose. Is there actually a difference between viscose and rayon?


This is a great looking shirt. I think its slouchy, relaxed vibe would be complemented perfectly with some Casatlantic trousers or similar higher rise pleated chinos.


I think the only way to carry off this look is to have darker skin or a tan.In the photos Simon there is too much pale skin on display which isn’t very flattering.A better alternative in my opinion would be a conventional dress shirt,perhaps in a blue fabric with the sleeves rolled up a little,slim chinos and Sagans or espadrilles.


My basic rule when it comes to wearing a casual shirt has always been to wear it untucked when I’m wearing shorts, and to tuck it in when I’m wearing full-length trousers.

Ryan Liu

It’s certainly a “Summer Look,” but unfortunately doesn’t work on me. I’ve tried some of these short-sleeved shirts at The Anthology Taipei just last week, and was really excited about it before I tried them on. Definitely agree on your comment that these shirts would work much better on people with more character, such as Ethan of Bryceland. What’s your take on boating stripes on short-sleeve shirts? The dos and don’t on the color combination or collar types/shapes for example. Thanks in advance.

Ryan Liu

You’re not wrong. At least for me, they are both hard to pull off, but I still appreciate the look, hence the question. Have it made with higher collar and trim it at the waist should make it suit me better, since my build is slim and tall (184cm, 72kg). Yet, I fear that this alteration would very largely change the silhouette of the shirt and loss the causal/holiday feel to it.
Color is another issue, I’ll stick with colder or more muted colors such as Navy, Olive, and Beige/cream. Warm colors just don’t work on me, or maybe that’s just personal preference.

Charles Leerhsen

Very nice shirt and interesting newsletter, as usual. I like the look of the undershirt (which I believe you call a vest) and would even think it was necessary, given the amount of chest the wearer would be showing otherwise. Do you agree?


Ιn hot climates like the one i live in, cotton undershirt is almost necessary becαuse it absorbs sweat, which would otherwise appear on the shirt. So, perhaps due to the given need, it became a summer style, mainly for old fashioned men (younger or older) who wear camp collar shirts.


Good morning Simon!
More than Europeans, not just northern Europeans! I guess it is 40’s American influences.. the young man in the sleevless underwear, the cigarete at the ear, the fire hydrant on the street corner spewing water.. Well, in the summer, i only use 100% cotton undershirt with sleeves, which are not visible ftom the wide and almost elbow length sleeves of the camp collar shirts. The reason, you just mentioned it above. And yes, i don’t understand why people use sleeveless underwear while we sweat mainly in our armpits. I also use those “vests”, but with white long sleeve shirts, in the winter (even with a tie and cufflinks) when the temperature is low and does not cause sweat. Thats because i dont like shirts worn directly to the skin and dont even want the underwear sleeve to show through the translucent formal shirt. Also use knee high, thin, cotton or linen socks with the tassel loafers, in the summer.. do not feel comfortable without..


I find that I sweat mainly on the front and back of the torso and not at all under the arms (effective anti-perspirant I guess). I’ve tried using undershirts with sleeves but I can’t get over the feeling that they interfere too much with the drape of the shirt sleeves. The vest is just where I sweat and nonexistent elsewhere. Also, the vests goes under t-shirts as well, which is useful when I want to wear my t-shirt untucked, but I don’t want to expose the small of the back when I lean over.


Yes Bjorn.. very accurate observation and unfortunately, you are 100% right about how the sleeved underwear interferes with the drape of the (formal mainly) shirt. The only solution that i see, is very thin and tight to the body, cotton undershirts. In the cold days its ok, because you have the suit jacket on.. so with the braces, some say that they must not be visible, as an underwear it used to be

Simon G

Re the undershirt here’s my two cents. I wear a T-shirt style in winter and an A-shirt in the summer.

I go with the latter because there is less fabric which I find cooler. Everyone is different but I find that the overall tradeoff suits me and mitigates sweat better than having a second t shirt style undershirt.


Good morning Simon G. Its nice to have a common ground for ideas about solving “problems”! I enjoy the noble dialogue with the readers of P.S.


A pair of Stan Smiths, would take this look to another level, pushing the envelope.


Hi Simon. Love the silhouette and the textures. A really sophisticated look. Shows how cold colours work with a Summer outfit.,

Aaron Lavacave

I accidentally made the Rayon leap this summer (with this: https://mobile.yoox.com/ca/12705817AV/item#dept=clothingmen&sts=SearchResult&cod10=12705817AV&sizeId=-1). I only realized once I had the tags off, and was busy kicking myself until the fabric won me over. The drape was so good (I also wear it tucked it). I’ve not yet been able to find another rayon shirt that drapes as well though. Now I see it’s on sale I’m tempted to buy another…


I like rayon shirts but I’m always disappointed by how much they seem to shrink with laundering. Perhaps I should try dry cleaning but that just seems excessive for a casual shirt.
Regardless, this is a nice look. The subtle slate-ish color of the shirt is nice.

Follow-up question: do you get linen trousers such as these lined to the knee? It seems a bit counterproductive since a linen is meant to be breathable, but I’ve encountered this in RTW many times.

William Kazak

I stopped buying rayon shirts when I gave away my aloha shirts years ago. The fabric did not breath like my summer linen shirts and it is a bit silly to wear an aloha shirt in the Midwest to my way of thinking. Your white undershirt showing does not look good in my opinion. Thank you for this discussion.


If you didn’t have PS would you still bother with off the rack shirts? Wouldn’t it be easier (though obviously more expensive) just to find some good rayon material and bring it to a tailor in that case? Even with the smaller collar, I don’t find this shirt particularly remarkable.


Yes, certainly if you don’t know exactly what your measurements are rtw can provide a useful reference. At this point I know my shirt dimensions precisely enough that rtw is never quite right, so I don’t bother. Using my local shop, the price disparity isn’t so significant either.


That shirt, i.e. short sleeves and deep front chest opening, is casual and not made to be tucked in or any other type of formal look. I would just wear it tucked out even if it looks blousy. Also, not a fan of the undershirt which shows.

Guy W

Very interesting article, Simon, thanks. Being from Sydney, where the summer’s are hot and humid, I’ve been increasingly experimenting with camp collars, but so far only in linen and pique cotton. Do you find Rayon tends to stick to you in hot weather, or does it stay comfortably off your skin as, for example, linen does?
A few of my thoughts on the camp collar style:

  • I actually always liked the more ‘fun’ patterns but, after trying them, decided I couldn’t pull it off. After seeing it on Manish in the first Reader Profile, I decided to give the style another go.
  • I’ve found the camp collar style works with more ‘vintage’ looking fabrics, something The Armoury does well with their ‘Summer Shirt’. I purchased one in a vintage linen brown stripe and was pleasantly surprised. I’ve really enjoyed pairing it with linen or high-twist wool trousers on a hot day. I think it can look distinctive, subtle (if you don’t go for a ‘fun’ pattern), elegant and comfortable in the heat.
  • Continuing on with the vintage theme, I’ve since purchased a green linen stripe from The Armoury and had one made in navy Giro Inglese, which feels very 1950s resort-wear but in a more subtle way.
  • I also found the Stoffa version to be excellent and more modern.
Gary Mitchell

These ‘vests on show’ are a strange thing, I see them in the movies and confess to thinking they look cool (in certain circumstances) but when I try it myself I feel awkward and slightly ridiculous… I guess we are only comfortable in things we are comfortable in.

Gary Mitchell

Aye it looks nice… on others… just cant get myself comfortable with it. T-shirt yes, vest no, and I have tried. Just one of those things eh, maybe the contrast with the hair all bursting forth at the top of the vest, who knows but I do like the shirt and agree with the collar size issues.

Gary Mitchell

Always thought myself more of a Lounge Lizard than a Lothario but yes…. Heading that direction


But patterns more broadly are probably best left for another day.”
A great future topic for sure. It seems to me there’s a fine line, but when done right … Bryceland‘s diver print rayon comes to mind. In many ways it’s so similar to a snoopy surfer print, yet there’s something so right about it. It seems like “the” shirt for summer 2022, based on how often I’ve seen it online.

J. Vantaa

I’m once again here with my very own two cents:
I personally tend to gravitate towards higher rise trousers when wearing looser fit shirts tucked, as it then accentuates wider shoulders to your hips and not the opposite, as it does as lower the rise goes.

Also to all the sneerers and smirkers towards rayon as a fabric:
It’s not the fabric , but the wearer that creates the elegance (exception to the rule might be full synthetics, though). Most folks here would see old worn in Barbour wax jacket giving their wearer more gravitas than anything when worn by a gentleman in British countryside, but an awful rag when draping from the shoulders of a LA hobo.

Also rayon in my view might be the superior fabric when it comes to the more tropical climates.


If only rayon/viscose/modal/bemberg/cupro were eco-friendly 🙁


As you rightly point out, a lot depends on personal style and preferences. I neither like short sleeved shirts nor camp collars, but this is subjective.
I wonder somewhat more about the showing white undershirt (t-shirt). I always believed this to be a – for the lack of a better word – objektive no-go.

Nigel C

Hi Simon – I always enjoy reads about the things of which I know little.
Totally off topic I see that the comments from people are in some cases quite resolute in their views. It got me thinking – we all have our clothing prejudices; often irrational.
Colours and colour combinations – burgundy anything, blue shirt and yellow tie. Full Windsor knots. Cufflinks with those turny bar things, although these days perhaps just cufflinks. It’s actually a long list but ….
They relate to certain times, people or situations in my case. I guess they now shape my taste. Nevertheless they are engrained in my thinking. I guess we all convert these to absolutes which we are not afraid of being quite vocal about.
Have you many?
Best wishes N


Interesting debate on rayon. There are a number of ‘semi synthetic’ materials around and a quick online search usually tells you all you need to know.
As for this style of shirt. I find that in plain colours it can look a bit like a uniform shirt, so I would go for an archive type geometric prints.
There are lots of low cost versions of this style around if just thinking of trying one out. That old favourite Uniqlo usually do some every year.
Plain or patterned, the neck always just feels too wide open for my taste, hence I always wear a crewe neck T-shirt under the one I own.
I really don’t get the singlet style vest though, (please don’t take this personally as I think your style is inspirational overall) it just looks unflattering in any context to me. The one exception being when worn by the late, great James Caan playing Sonny I the Godfather.


Of course I understand that being in this business means that you try out different styles and ideas and present them to your readers for discussion. This article is an excellent and useful example of this. My take on this look is that it’s best suited for overweight guys who want a looser fitting shirt. The shirt is boxy and obscures the waistline, particularly when tucked in, and therefore doesn’t work well for men who are fit or at least not overweight. The “wife beater” t-shirt underneath is definitely a no no. Lastly, I’d say that cotton and linen are still the best fabrics for warmer weather as I’ve never liked rayon.


Is the vest Sunspel? If so, I wonder what size you take. I’ve found their medium size vest and underwear t-shirt rather loose. Thanks


I think what this outfit needs is a Panama hat or equivalent trilby and resort backdrop, bet all the negative opinions would disappear!


Would a white or blue button down shirt in Rayon look good?
Could it probably a good alternative to Oxford in summer?


I’m firmly in the short sleeve camp shirt camp. Not tucked. No undershirt. No flowers or psychedelic patterns. Linen or cotton blend. The collars in my view are more flattering then regular ones on a short sleeve shirt. I think tucked in sends a mixed signal in this case. Making an inherently informal item more formal, maybe? Plus a square hem means it wasn’t designed for tucking, doesn’t it? Love the discourse though…..


Hi Simon,
Thanks for this post on rayon as used in making shirts! Frankly, I wouldn’t have consider rayon as a fabric worth considering when it comes to shirt.
This piece looks good on you! And thanks to its color, It also happens to be very versatile within the realm of smart casual trousers, and even shoes, as here with the EG black suede Belgravia! A great feat in terms of functionality, as you know!


I, too, like these types of shirts in hot weather, and I also wear them tucked. Besides looking much smarter, I find that untucking the shirt doesn’t really make me feel cooler. What DOES make me feel better is leaving the top one or two buttons undone, and wearing a shirt with a bit of a looser, drapier fit. That gives me air circulation while still looking sharp.

In a similar vein, I’m also a fan of quality Hawaiian/aloha shirts. Like everything, there is a range of quality to these shirts, both in terms of construction and in terms of pattern, and I find it pays to get one or two high quality ones rather than a bunch of the lower end ones. Once you wear one of the really good ones, it’s hard to go back. And I wear these tucked as well.


Sure! Keep in mind I’m not a great reviewer, so it’s hard for me to put into words. But the nicer shirts feel like their material is higher quality. It’s thicker and more substantial. The buttons are nicer, not plastic. And the colors are richer, and more vibrant, with a broader range of colors. Also, there’s the nature of the pattern or print itself. This is subjective but the nicer shirts look like paintings, they’re not just a basic pattern repeated over and over. Or if it is a pattern, it’s an aesthetically pleasing one that is visually interesting. Again, subjective.

Some brands I’ve liked are Sun Surf, Pagong Kyoto, and, surprisingly, Cordone 1956, the Italian shirt maker.


Hi Craig (and Simon),
Re some Hawaiian shirt brands, my Uncle who was a Honolulu resident for 45 years recommended these companies a while back:
Baileys Antiques and Aloha shirts
The first three are makers and the last is a retailer of new and vintage shirts.
All the manufacturer’s above are Hawaiian (Aloha) shirt specialists I believe rather than “inspired by”, with manufacture in Hawaii until at least a few years ago – not sure now.
Materials include rayon and silk, both of which are authentic depending upon which origin story you go for.
I really have wanted a Hawaiian shirt for many years and now with our increasingly sunny, warm summers and more casual dressing I think they would no longer look wildly out of place in the UK.
Many thanks.


Simon.. Tori Richard, Honolulu


Could shirts like these be suitable for casual wear?


I have a few shirts and it’s collars are not the best part about it.
What do you think about cutting up the collars and converting it into a band collar shirt


Simon, have you tried Wythe New York’s rayon shirts? Really great colours. I’ve also been looking for rayon shirts recently after discovering they are incredibly good in the heat. They’re not unbreatheable at all… the opposite in fact. I used to think linen was the solution but find it much less cmtotsbke than rayon. Almost grabbed a few Wythe pieces during the No Man Walks Alone sale, but they don’t ship outside the US!


May I please ask which size shirt did you take in this?


Thanks Simon


At Clutch Cafe they use M/L/XL…
Do you mean L or XL?


Great look, Simon. Loving the brown and dark navy/black together. I also think that, as you’ve said in the past, the pop of white makes a world of (positive) difference here. Mind my asking what size you went with on this one? Thanks.


Nice shirt; what’s rayon like for wicking & creasing?
My take on shirts in or out is dependant on how smart are the trousers & how warm is it. Smart creased trousers need a tucked in smart shirt which gives a crisp elegant look as you say. But with more casual linen or chinos I’d certainly have out if warm & more circulation was required. Likewise with shorts I’d wear out unless wanting to look English ‘colonial’. What’s your take on shorts & shirts Simon.
Long sleeved linen shirts definitely tucked in for me, but might have out if sleeves folded up to elbow area – as more casual.
as you say rules can be interpreted & broken as long as you’re aware of how the look changes.


i understand the comparisons with silk & linen; silk I find can retain sweat a tad & doesn’t wick away the moisture as much as a more open weave linen, especially when tucked & humid. A I haven’t knowingly worn rayon; does it iron well? Needless to say it’s sold out.
Regarding short sleeved shirt/ shorts, I’d only wear a soft or camp collar, not stiff, otherwise I’d agree with the child like comparison if the shirt were white, grey or striped with a school cap ?
Generally though if it is hot & humid I’d wear the shirt out for circulation & it aids in reducing a creased wet look. The rayon shirt looks nice either way.

colin macdonald

IMHO those collars are awful

J Crewless

There’d be less criticism of the shirt if the color were more of a summery hue.

Looks a bit too gloomy for the current season. Which is what makes it look “off.”

Don’t have any experience wearing rayon so don’t have anything valuable to contribute in that regard.

Jean-Marc Turmes

Hi there! 🙂
I can recommend the camp collar shirt by Besnard. Great fit that’s quite relaxed, and the bottom line is straight.
My personal problem with wearing shirts tucked in is related to trouser rise. I’m one of those who can’t keep a waisted trouser on the waist without suspenders. However, I do consider suspenders to be an under-garment, so just wearing them without having jacket of some sort in the outfit still seems a bit odd to me.
So what I do in summertime is that I pretty much wear lower cut trousers (pants, tbh) with the shirts untucked. I try to compensate the loss in elegance with the help of a panama hat and one of many Ascot ties that I tie in a rather relaxed way, thinking of it almost as a summer-scarf.
I would love to wear stuff the way you show here, which looks super, but unfortunately my body just doesn’t allow for it…
This is my first comment, but I’ve been following your content for a while now 🙂
Best regards and many thanks!


Question for you on the Besnard shorts, Jean-Marc. I’m looking at their giro inglese fabric camp collar shirts and wanted to know if you have an experience with them and how shear they are in person.


As it often happens, a guideline rather than a hard rule seems to be an interesting exercise here as regards what collar width looks most pleasing from a subtle chic perspective. Perhaps two-thirds to one-half the width of the wearer’s face is a good baseline for experimenting?


Oh, certainly! This is purely for establishing a jump-off point, which is where the process (and the fun) begins.


Why would one wear Rayon in hot weather . Isn’t it polyester ?

Lindsay McKee

Is that Pherrows shirt in navy or black?

Amrinder Saraogi

What is your opinion on shirts being worn untucked? Not the smart poplins but casual linen shirts or Oxfords.


Hi Simon, I have noticed that you mostly wear black suede loafers rather than calf leather when you wear dark brown linen trousers and I thought you found the black suede shoes unusual. Could I ask why? Would the calf leather look too stark in summer?

Many thanks,


Okay, so would you say both could work for a casual outfit? If I were to buy a pair of black loafers for summer, would you suggest getting them in calf first?


Alright. Thanks, Simon.


Simon, have you tried the lyocell camp collar shirts from Portuguese Flannel?
I got one that has a similar cut, however the material has a weird feel to it, almost “oily”. It kinda feels like if they made a shirt from cupro lining, except it isn’t cupro, it’s lyocell, reportedly.
Very weird, also because I’ve been wearing lyocell underwear for 2 years (CDLP) and they really feel like a fresh and very soft cotton instead.

Robert M

I have just received my first lyocell shirt from Portuguese Flannel (the Dogtown model). It does look a bit different than on their website. The photos suggest something a bit more shiny, and the shirt I got looks more matte, almost like it’s been washed. I actually prefer it this way, so on first look I can definitely recommend. Now let’s see how it’s going to perform.


Simon, I’m looking at commissioning a casual warm weather Safari-type shirt. Neutral color, likely khaki, two flap chest pockets, probably a linen blend. It will have long sleeves which I’ll no doubt roll up. I’m trying to decide between a hem length that will be tucked versus a shorter straight hem like mentioned in this article to wear untucked. Any suggestions?


Any advice on where to get a decent vest/singlet? Keen to try the look under a shirt, but would rather not spend £££ if anyone can suggest a good high street option

Manish Puri

Hi Doug

How about Uniqlo at just under a tenner?


Will try it! Thank you


Hi Simon,

Did you consider wearing a traditional undershirt, rather than a vest?

See the look from stoffa: https://stoffa.co/collections/shirts/products/indigo-wool-linen-herringbone-long-sleeve-camp-shirt.

I like the idea of wearing vests, but this looks like a more approachable and subtle version of wearing a jersey underneath, in my opinion. Would love to hear your thoughts on this.


Hi Simon, feeling inspired this, and with summer round the corner, i am thinking of picking up one of these shirts – this year’s version is not available in navy, but there is a light grey version that i am interested in (the other option is black, but i don’t like the idea if a black shirt in a material like this). Actually, they are in a polyester/cotton blend, but the look seems to be the same as the rayon you wore.

Pherrow’s Open Collar Shirt Light Grey – Clutch Cafe (clutch-cafe.com)

My question, do you think this would be too smart for pairing with PS shorts (i have the beige and green versions)? In particular, the fabric seems quite smooth, without much texture, and i see that you pair it with tailored trousers/leather shoes, whereas i am thinking of Doeks and PS shorts.

Many thanks.


Many thanks Simon. Fair point on looking washed out, and not something i had considered.

Just wondering, in the article you mention that a wider collar can look abit naff (my interpretation of your words) – do you think the collar on this Real McCoys one would suffer from that?
The Real McCoy’s Silk Rayon Open Collar Shirt – Navy (rivetandhide.com)

The material looks really lovely, but the collar is rather retro. I wasn’t sure if this was the kind of collar size you are not keen on, or if you mean the seriously large ones.



Thanks Simon, much appreciated.