Introducing: The navy Donegal Coat
The cut and contours of this, the PS Donegal Coat, will be familiar to most readers. So I’ll focus on the colour to begin with.
This is our navy iteration, and it is primarily a large, 3x3 herringbone weave that alternates between navy and black. The combination gives the coat the true dark navy colour prized by fans of classic menswear.
But I wouldn’t want it to be just that. Partly because that’s not what a donegal coat is - we’re using authentic donegal yarn, and there have to be flecks a plenty - but also because I didn’t want this to be just a conservative, formal business-type coat.
The thing that pleased me most about last year’s iteration, the large mid-grey herringbone, was that it wasn’t quite what people were expecting. The pattern was larger than a traditional overcoat, and this gave it a contemporary feel.
It surprised some readers, but in the end became the most successful collaboration we’ve ever done. That classic pattern, in a slightly larger size, made it wearable with everything from suits to sweats.
This year’s navy is in the same vein.
It’s dark, but the number of brown, cream and grey flecks in it make the coat much less conservative, and (to me) more interesting.
It’s still classic enough to wear with a charcoal suit, white shirt and black shoes (above). But I think it also looks very stylish - clean and modern - with just a navy knit (below).
In fact, there are three slightly different office outfits here, in perhaps a futile attempt to reflect many levels of formality: flannel suit and shirt; navy knit and shirt; navy knit alone. All worn with black loafers and the occasional navy watch cap.
And then thre’s an outfit with jeans and a sweatshirt (below) to show how the same colours could be used in something that is more casual still.
That’s a grey sweat from The Real McCoy’s, over a PS T-shirt, with Rubato jeans and Alden boots. The coat looks just as good with a light-wash jean, but the dark denim continues the theme.
Oh and there’s also a shot lower down of the coat with a pink oxford shirt, just to remind us of a different colour navy looks great with. Although no one here needs instructions on what looks good with navy.
Milad Abedi and I shot this around Somerset House and another few places in London, on a cold and overcast day - and I was struck by how many compliments the coat got.
It might have been that no one had expected the suddenly cold weather, and were envious of any coat at all. But I think it was at least partly how interesting the pattern is.
Walking in and out of the Somerset House cafe, on different occasions, a man and a woman both said ‘nice coat’ as they passed. Anyone who lives in London will know how rare that is, and I can’t help feeling there’s something about this iteration that draws people in.
It’s not anonymous, like a plain navy; but it doesn’t declare itself loudly either. Milad said it reminded him of the images the James Webb space telescope started sending back earlier this year, and I know what he means. The depth of space, with all the constellations scattered across it.
Anyway, that’s 500 words on why I really like this coat, and chose it for this year’s iteration. It is available now on the Permanent Style shop.
For those that haven’t been following this collaboration for the past few years, here are some of the details.
The PS Donegal Coat was born out of a need for a versatile coat that could be worn with jeans for a walk, or tailoring to the office. Something that could be thrown on, almost without thought, and yet be rigorously designed such that it always flattered the wearer.
To that end, it is a little longer than most (but can be shortened if required) to add a touch of flair, and that’s balanced by a slightly higher collar that effectively frames the face. The collar stays up when put up, due to curved insert on the neck. The standard throat latch is reshaped to sit more elegantly when not in use.
It has both two internal breast pockets, and a large hip pocket in which to keep a hat, book or anything else bulky. The outer hip pockets are lined with cashmere (always my favourite touch).
It has a distinctive yet subtle lining in antique gold; and the buttons are two-hole buffalo horn - a style more commonly seen on Savile Row, and reflecting my love of bespoke.
Just as important as the style, though - in fact probably more so - is the Donegal yarn.
Donegal tweed is so pleasing and unique in its texture. There’s slubbiness in there, an authentic and natural feel, plus great colour variation when you look closely, but compared to other traditional cloths it never feels old-fashioned - unlike a big windowpane check.
The tweed is spun exclusively for us by Donegal Yarns in Ireland, the last remaining mill that makes the yarn - before being woven in Lancashire and manufactured by Private White VC in Manchester.
You can read all about Donegal Yarns in our factory visit - to the Willy Wonka of wool - here.
Alterations
To start with on alterations, I should also say that the coat can be lengthened as well as shortened, and I’ve done that on a couple of my coats, which I prefer. But then I’m above average height (6 foot) and have a predisposition towards longer coats.
- The coat deliberately has more inlay than most RTW coats, increasing the possibilities for alteration.
- Length can easily be shortened - up to 10cm without interrupting much of the balance. It can also be lengthened slightly, by up to 5cm.
- The sleeves can be lengthened by around 4cm if required.
- And they can be shortened. Shortening by 1.5cm would be easy - more than that would require the wrist strap to be moved.
- The sleeve width can be increased from bicep to cuff up to 2.5cm.
- The body - chest, waist, and hem width - can be increased by up to 4cm in circumference.
Ordering:
- The coats are available at William Crabtree in London for the next couple of weeks, to try on if you would like to. Purchases are then made online.
- The coat costs £825 plus VAT. (The price has gone up slightly, only to reflect increased costs.)
- At the moment it is exclusively available through Permanent Style, on the webshop here.
- There are sizes from XS (chest 46, Private White size 2) up to XXL.
- Have a close look at the measurements below if you're unsure of sizing, and if in doubt compare them to a coat you already own.
- The fit is pretty standard, however, so taking your normal size is usually safe.
- I am six-foot tall and usually wear a size 50-chest jacket. I am wearing a Medium (4).
- As with all PS products, there are free returns should you want to change sizes. Ships from the UK.
Measurements:
| X-Small/2 | Small/3 | Medium/4 | Large/5 | X-Large/6 | XX-Large/7 | |
| Chest | 50.5cm | 53 | 56.5 | 60 | 63.5 | 67 |
| Waist | 52 | 54.5 | 58 | 61.5 | 65 | 68.5 |
| Bottom hem | 58.5 | 61 | 64.5 | 68 | 71.5 | 75 |
| Length | 108.4 | 109 | 110 | 111 | 112 | 113 |
| Sleeve | 81 | 82 | 83 | 84 | 85 | 86 |
| Cuff (width) | 13.8 | 14.1 | 14.5 | 14.9 | 15.3 | 15.7 |
Beautiful coat, Simon. Unfortunately too long for my taste. With my 175cm and very slim built, I prefer much shorter coats that end at mid-thigh; otherwise I look lost. But I see the elegance of a longer coats for men that are significantly taller.
Thanks Markus. It can of course be shortened considerably, as set out at the end of the article. But it shouldn’t really be shortened to mid-thigh
Simon have you thought about having a Slack or similar where followers can interact with you live? it would be quite interesting for those that cannot meet you in person at pop ups. Anyhow, what is your thought on the survival of tailoring in the near future given all of the casual movements in the office? It feels almost strange to invest into tailoring given that everything is going casual, whether the office, the gentleman club, or the high end cocktail bar, causal seems to make tailoring feel out of place. Maybe it is not that extreme, but it is getting there. What are your thoughts?
Hey PS,
I have, and that would be nice. The issue is time really – I already spend up to 2 hours every day answering people’s comments, and the big advantage of those is that the answers stay there, all categorised by article, so people can see them in the future. It’s like a big reference resource, whereas anything live isn’t very organised and gets a little lost, if that makes sense.
Maybe an occaional thing though, like you say as an alternative to an event?
I think the middle of the suit market has been kicked out – the guys wearing a suit to the office every day and not really enjoying it. But the high-end market is doing well, because suits are more special – something for an event, a smart drink etc. There’s still nothing else someone would wear that would signal that kind of dressing up – see our piece on cocktail attire too for more on that.
I also think that while there will be fewer suits, most men and most offices still want a degree of smartness, and that’s where things like more casual chic come in – tailored trousers with good knits etc. More on that here.
Maybe it’s more to do with slimness, but I’m only 180cm, I don’t think 5cm shorter would truly make you look lost in it – Ethan Wong is shorter than either of us and he sometimes wears big, long coats and looks great. I think it’s partly a case of getting used to and comfortable with something a bit different.
I’m 172 cm and my favourite overcoat (I would even say my favourite piece of clothing) is well below the knee. I know that they make me look shorter and it’s been noticed even by “non menswear people” but apart from more elegant they are significantly more practical when it gets really cold.
Good point Dario
Markus, you can wear a longer coat that will actually lengthen your silhouette visually. As long as the shoulders aren’t overly wide, you can achieve a tall slim look.
I think if you get the coat to fall slightly below the knee -like an inch or two- it should be just touching the top of your calf.
Some would say half calf or slightly lower. I know it’s another inch or so but that starts to shorten the legs.
I think Flusser’s Dressing the Man describes it better.
Try it out Markus, you might find you can get into longer coats easier than you thought.
Oh come on, Simon, be fair! I’ve already got two of your Donegal coats – the brown, and last year’s grey herringbone – and now I find myself desperately trying to rationalise the purchase of another one! I’ve had more compliments on the Donegals than anything else – I’m looking forward to colder weather just to have an excuse to wear them again. Repeat after me: “I do not need another Donegal coat, I do not need another Donegal coat…”
To be serious for a moment, this looks utterly gorgeous and if I didn’t already have far too many coats I’d snap one up in a heartbeat…
Thank you Paul, that’s so nice
I agree. Time to update the “if you only need 5 coats” article- just get all the colours of this beauty
You need an article, If you can only have 5 PS coats….. ?
if you manage to get colours you want, PS is enough for a coat capsule… for me it would be bridge coat, charcoal Donegal, olive trench, wax walker, and brown valstarino. I’m half way there!
Looks great in navy. I love how readily apparent the flecks are against the navy. If I had the money and space I would love to have one in each colour. As it is the brown one brings me great joy whenever I get to wear it.
actually a really lovely colour! but going purely by colour, and seing as I’m trying to end up with no more than 4-5 pieces out outerwear, and I already have your bridge coat, I don’t think its a good idea to have 2 navy coats.
Simon. The coat looks like the night’s sky. It’s beautiful of course. And really based on these photos I would call it the most casual one of the donegal coats you’ve produced, very bright despite being dark navy.
I hope you’ll forgive me if I say it slightly brings to mind a cartoon wizard’s blue robe covered with stars and moons. Obviously it doesn’t *look* like that, but I am reminded of it!
Ha! Love it. I’m going with pictures of deep space, I feel like those robes were a rather brighter blue
Yes that’s true, I hope you understand that the association was pretty loose. I suppose what I was really try to get at is that the coat is fun. And it’s an excellent implementation of the often dicey idea of “fun” in classic menswear. Huge fan. Unfortunately my list of coats to get is already too long for this winter. I hope to see it again in future years.
Yeah that makes complete sense Matt – it’s more interesting, more creative. Interestingly I could see it both on a fashion catwalk and in a classic menswear wardrobe.
what about grey one? I could have sworn you said there will be couple pieces for those that didn’t preorder and I was on waitlist for that one.
We’re still trying to tie up the last few from the pre-orders Martins, then we’ll know what if anything is available from the other colours
thank you!
The coat indeed looks wonderful, Simon. May I ask if you are considering offering say a sports jacket in similar styles in the future? All else being equal, I will not hesitate for a moment snapping it up. I’m sure I can’t be the only one interested either.
Cheers RK.
But no, I would never offer a ready-made sports coat – I would always recommend people have those made to measure. Even with the Donegal, I only offer it as a coat because it’s not a style it makes much sense to have made by a tailor
Hi Simon, which one do you think is more versatile, this navy or the previous grey herringbone?
I have unfortunately missed the pre-order of the grey version, when will it be available at the webshop?
Thank you.
There should be a small number of greys available at the end of October.
I’d say they’re both equally versatile, but this is a touch smarter, and a touch better with darker clothes perhaps, like the ones shown here
Ahh Simon, man, this is really, REALLY nice. First thing’s first, great choice of outfits on this one, from smart to more casual, from black to grey to colour 8, I know you must put thought into a shoot like this, always does the PS products justice, that includes the setting, beautiful London architecture in this case.
I think this is my favourite iteration to date. Reason for that is, as you mention yourself, the slightly larger 3×3 and the Donegal yarn with just a touch of character, it’s like a dark, inky version of last years grey. I think the black in the herringbone plays a large part in why this works so well in smart outfits as well as casual, applicable to all the iterations, would that be fair to say?
Now, since you mentioned the shearling coming up in a couple months time, I’m keeping my powder dry for that, otherwise I’d be pulling the trigger on this in a heartbeat. My finances can only stretch so far. And even then, I’m still tempted.
I suppose that leads onto my last question… Will we see a return of the preorder early next year with the navy included? And actually, lastly, where do you go from here? The four iterations seem to cover all bases, what next?
Thanks CK, that’s so nice to hear. And yes I think you’re right on the black.
We’re not planning to redo the pre-order next year, no. Sorry.
And as to a colour for next year, to be honest I haven’t even thought about it yet!
I must say this is my least favourite of all iterations. Maybe it’s just the photos, but the flecks seem to stand out way too much against the navy background. I certainly see the night-sky comparison, but for me it’s not really a positive. Of course it’s not exactly the same as all the weird fashion inventions you see all around, but I’d say that for PS standards, it looks pretty statement-y. Then again, maybe it will grow on me, and of course other commenters seem to like it very much – it would be boring if we all liked the same things.
Btw, here you say the coat can be lengthened by 5 cm and the sleeves by 4, but the shop page says it’s 2 cm each. Which is it?
Thanks Robert. Yes as I said in the piece, this wasn’t meant to be a more classic, conservative navy, and it sounds like that might suit you more.
On the lengthening, this page is right. I’ll update the shop page now. Thanks for highlighting it.
Hi Simon, does this mean the other models can also be lengthened with 5 rather than 2 cm?
I’m pretty sure, yes, but I’m just going to double check with the factory just in case
Thanks Simon. Any chance of re-stocking a size 8 in the brown one?
It’s unlikely, sorry Joachim, but do put your name down on the waiting list for that size and colour just in case. We do still get returns and exchanges
No option to do so, as size 8 is not available in the menu I’m afraid.
Ah sorry JB, I didn’t register the size when you said it – we don’t do an 8 in any of the coats, so we wouldn’t get one back. Apologies
The coat looks brilliant. The joy is that it can be worn in so many settings.
Beautiful flowing coat which would suit a big hat.
Very dramatic. Certainly one for making an entrance.
Great coat! Do you think it could be worn with a navy suit?
Absolutely – it’s great with navy, just like the images with a navy crewneck here.
Thanks Simon. And related to this as I’m weighing up which coat to go for: does the charcoal Donegal coat work well with grey flannels?
Yes it does, but it’s a little unlikely there will be any charcoal available David
I think i wont be far off saying that charcoal was most popular out of past 3 iterations? Maybe makes sense to bring it back in a year?
No actually Martins it was the least popular of the three
really? I thought that charcoal was sold out, but brown and light grey was not.. or maybe you just ordered different amounts? oh well, in that case I hope I’ll manage to snag a light grey one if it shows up.
Yes they all sold out, but we ordered more of the second and third colours, once we knew how popular the design was
As vain as this sounds, I’m happy to hear the option I went with was the least popular. Less of a chance of running into somebody out and about with the same coat as mine.
All three donegal costs are beautiful. For making a bespoke coat in these or similar cloths, which mills / books do you recommend Simon?
Do you mean a raglan coat like this David, or a more regular tailored overcoat?
If a raglan, there isn’t that much point having it bespoke if you can find a cloth you like RTW – it’s one reason we offer that style, but only collaborated on a DB overcoat when it was handmade (with the Anthology).
I was chatting to Enzo Ciardi this morning about this coat, and he said his father, a well-known cutter, always bought raglans (balmacaan style) RTW
My idea is a regular tailored overcoat probably DB polo coat style, normal shoulders and a touch of waist suppression. In fact these donegal fabrics could be well used in many styles for their versatility, good visual interest and bridging formalities.
Aha, I see. Yes I think they could, true.
To be honest I haven’t seen that many donegals in coating bunches, but I haven’t looked for a while. I’d go to W Bill, Holland & Sherry and Harrisons first off
Wasn’t there a plan to sell your donegal fabric by meter at Permanent Style shp?
No, we offered it to people as part of the pre-order process back in the Spring, but not now. I think there is a little left of the brown, if anyone wanted it, but that’s all.
Would there be enough to make another coat? Can’t blame a guy for trying.. 😉
Drop me an email JB if you want, we can see if Private White would do it as an MTO
Wonderful iteration Simon! I still love my first edition in the charcoal donegal. Is there any inlay to let the sleeves out width wise in the first edition. They can me a little snug with a jacket under it.
Thanks Joel.
I don’t think there was, it’s going back a few years but I think we added that later.
Gorgeous coat! With a chest of 42.5-43 inches and height of 5’11” I think size large is the appropriate size for me. Do you agree?
Yes I would have thought so. However, I do think some people prefer this coat to fit a little closer, others love room in the body. I strongly suggest comparing the measurements against a coat you already own if you can
Hi Simon, glad to see the coat back! Two questions, one on topic, one off:
1. Any plans on bringing back the brown version?
2. I’m currently looking for a darker denim that bridges the gap between sporty and casual-smart (if there is such thing with jeans). I would wear it like you with a nice overcoat and a Sweatshirt, but maybe also with a rather casual shirt once in a while. What would be your go-to and why; Blackhorse Lane, Rubato or Anglo-Italian?
Thanks in advance Simon.
Hey Felix,
1. There might be a handful at the end of October, when we have the pre-orders all sorted out.
2. I’d say Rubato or Blackhorse Lane, just because I don’t like the Italian denims at Anglo quite so much. Of those two,I think it’s mostly a question of which cut and fit works for you best
It’s a really beautiful coat, just like the previous ones. Will those of us in New York be able to try one on when you visit? I am hoping to find that I would be able to have one shortened (and of course the sleeves shortened) without disfiguring it too much
You should be able to, yes Jeff. We have enough that I’m pretty confident there will be some left by then
Hi Simon:
a simple question: noticed your jeans had cuffs in the donegal coat piece. Are your jeans always cuffed? I don’t recall reading about this in any of your columns.
not so simple question with apologies for being so lacking in understanding. You wrote that the XS size of the donegal coat was a 46, but the chart reads 50.5. You also wrote that you usually take a size 50 medium but the chart reads 56.5 for medium. Perhaps it’s because I’m in the United States and not used to these.
many thanks.
Hey Howie,
Yes I pretty much always cuff them. I think I’ll do a separate piece on why some time though. A few people have asked.
On the sizing, the 46 I refer to is the jacket chest size that most people would wear, that would wear that size of coat. It’s European chest sizing – the American equivalent is 10 less, so 36. I would take a 40 jacket in the US, which would be a 50 in Europe.
How does the weight of the fabric compare with past iterations? If I recall, the brown was heavier than the grey.
Yes, the brown was heavier, but last year’s (mid-grey herringbone) we felt was just right. So all three coats are now in that weight
I already own the second iteration of this coat (brown) and its stunning but this is the colour ive always wanted, navy. Cant wait to get my hands on one.
Lovely to hear Allan. Any help you need with that, just ask the support team ([email protected])
Hi Simon, congratulations on another beautiful iteration of this coat, the fabric is really beautiful! I didn’t see this color available as a cut length for pre-order, is there any chance there’s some extra fabric around?
No I’m afraid not, sorry Alex.
I live in the southeastern United States. The average temperature in the winter is about 55 degrees Fahrenheit. Would you say this coat is too heavy for my winters?
It would be fine in that temperature with a light sweater underneath, I would have thought. It is a little personal though. Do you ever wear other coats in that type of winter?
Mostly jackets with a light lining.
OK, well I think that gives you a sense of it then – if you don’t really ever wear a coat, you don’t need this one, but it isn’t very heavy so the times when you do want a coat, this would slot in
What size would I need to order if I’m a 46L?
You mean 46 European or British/American Douglas?
If 46 American, so 56 European, I’d say an XL or a XXL. However, people do vary in how they like these to fit – they’re naturally roomy, and some people embrace that, some want to lessen it a bit. I’d suggest comparing the measurements against a coat you already own if you can, that’s by far the best way to tell
Can’t have enough Donegal Yarn. Absolutely beautiful coat. I would buy for myself. I love your style. BRAVO !!!
Lovely to hear, thanks Janet
Simon – beautiful coat. I want one! But realistically, I live in South Alabama which is subtropical – mild winters (though characterized by short cold waves) and long, hot and humid summers. Is this too much coat for that climate?
Hey Bob – maybe see comments above from Mark, he is asking about the same thing. Have a look at what I said and see if that answers your question
I was wapry of a navy iteration but naturally you’ve knocked it out of the park again, might even be my new favourite.
That extra inlay is making me very tempted indeed, as the only things stopping me having one of these already is having lost weight and too much choice.
Which version is your mccoys sweat?
the only one that comes close in their web is this- https://therealmccoys.com/collections/tops/products/10oz-sweatshirt-grey
but the colour seems off to yours?
See comments above Andy – it’s the Ball Park model
Morning Simon, Very nice coat & good to see allowance for alteration for a better fit or as anyone changes shape with age – coats should be for life & not just for Christmas.
Does Tony know you have his beretT? – nice alternative for some but I’d not risk the hiss take from friends & think the beanie warmer, more varied & versatile.
Yeah, it’s definitely a more risky one, more out there, but sometimes that’s what you want – it’s a bit more exciting too!
And absolutely, I bought it from Tony!
Yes a bit more risky but it looks good & probably a bit of a ‘head turner’.
We’ll it’s part of Tony’s DNA & it looks good on you too, but not for me this winter.
Hi Simon, Can’t download your piece on the sliding scale & trousers, the other three articles are accessible; is it at your end?
Thanks,
steve
You mean clicking through to them from the newsletter Steve? That article does seem to be quite slow to load, yes, not sure why. It does come up eventually though.
I’ll ask my developer to have a look at what’s going on with that one
Yes Simon, it’s not downloading, had no problem yesterday though.
Thanks Steve
Just an incredible coat. This is formal enough for me for 99% of situations and casual enough for any situation. Just bought mine after 3 years of thinking about it. Looking forward to receiving it!
Amazing. I hope you get many years of joy out of it Rickard
Glorious coat. I am a 5 foot-5″ tall woman, slender build. I wear size 4 (US) dresses. Would this blue donegal coat simply overwhelm me without drastic tailoring, or do I have a chance? Thanks
I find it hard to say Nancy, given I don’t know that much about women’s sizing. Do you have another coat you can compare at least the chest and length measurements to?
Thanks for your suggestion. I will try the comparative measurement hack, but I may be just too small to be able to tailor the coat without a major, major intervention
Sorry if that’s the case Nancy
Simon,
Would you consider limiting or stopping the run on future Donegals? I bought the grey last year and unfortunately have already had 3 occasions in London running into other PS readers with the same good taste. Cue not insignificant embarrassment – it’s such a characteristic style. Charming and unique when alone, but quite embarrassing when someone else wearing the same as it’s so obvious!
I guess that’s a little bit of a personal thing, Marek – I quite like that when it happens.
But in general, yes we aren’t planning on carrying on the designs – originally they were only available for one year, and the people who bought the grey would all have bought the coat within a space of a month or so. It was only this year we took the more unusual decision to offer the old ones on pre-order.
That’s genuinely great to hear – part of the joy is I think feeling like not everyone has the same thing
Yes I can see that Marek. Thanks
Question of pure curiosity–when doing overcoat photoshoots on city streets, assuming these are all shot in a single session, where do you go to change what you have on underneath?
You know, no one’s ever asked that before! It’s usually the changing rooms of friendly shops, or if needed, a cafe bathroom.
Thanks for demystifiying it, Simon! Not a classic red phone box then, superman style?
No, never understood that – the things nothing but windows!
I wondered the same thing – for example when travelling to Paris for work, do you wear rougher clothes and then change into the photo shoot outfits? Your shoes always look free of wear, clothes never rumpled or stained!
In that case thank you very much, because no I don’t. With pretty much all the travel I do and have shown, I travel in the things I then shoot. I guess I’m fairly good at looking after my clothes
I don’t know if I can justify buying another overcoat right now but I must say, this coat is absolutely gorgeous. It almost looks like a starry night sky, which is really quite striking. It might be my favorite PS product I’ve seen so far, which is really saying a lot. I hope something like this is offered again at some point.
Wonderful, thanks Nate. We do have a good few this year, so hopefully it will be around for a while
Simon, did you use the same maker as the previous models?
Yes, they’ve all been made by Private White VC in Manchester
This is great coat. I am 190 / 90 Kg. Any recommendations on size? Thank you.
I’d recommend comparing the chest measurement to coat you already own Max, and if in doubt size up (as a raglan is meant to fit a little loose)
Beautiful fabric! If I can make just one suggestion, can you make the lapel on the next edition wider and rework the lines (a more evenly balanced notch) to integrate more with the flowing lines of rest of the coat please?
I really like the overall classic menswear feel but the design needs to be taken up a notch to compete with the likes of SEH Kelly whose pieces offer more luxurious detailing
Thank you!
Hi Hugh,
Thanks for the suggestions, but I wouldn’t change the lapel line to be wider, or alter that balance at all – it would make it a different style of coat for me. I like the lines as they are here.
Cheers
Dear Simon!
1) I thought about the navy donegal as an addition to the 2 coats I wore mostly over tailoring last cold season. These are a heavy (800g) navy double breasted coat and the PS wax walker (which I wore almost every day, also on the weekends of course.) I love both of them, but the navy donegal could be an intelligent addition in between the two I think. The navy DB is lovely but just a bit too heavy and formal for most days, so I basically use it when I want to dress up or the weather calls for it. And the wax walker gets used almost too often, so I want to spare it. and I like the high-low aesthetic, but I don’t want that every day, because it gets boring for me. Plus something feels wrong with the wax walker when I am wearing a tie (that’s the case ca. 3 days a week). I imagine the donegal would be better here. The navy version of the donegal would be the easiest (compared to the grey one f.e.) for somebody like me who will wear it mostly with grey flannels and a sports jacket?
2) what’s your résumé on the rubato jeans? I was only unsure about the leg opening first. Over 20cm was something I had to get used to. Now after some weeks, I love everything about them. It is so nice to have a cut that is close at the waist, so still no belt needed by me, and everything else is just comfortable enough, but not baggy.
Hey Alexander
I think that makes sense on the navy donegal, absolutely.
On the jeans, yes I really love them.
What’s the weight of the current navy version again? Around 600g? Thanks
760g – all details on the product page
Yes, sorry, can’t figure out why I missed it.
No worries
Ηello Simon from Athens, Greece. Winter is coming and everyone talks about measures to prevent energy expenditure. We all know that in offices the temperature is going to be lower. Do you think there is going to be a return to heavier fabrics or to the use of vests for practical reasons (not just for style) ; Perhaps jumpers at work will become the new ”must”.
To conclude do you think the energy crisis will change the way we dress ?
Keep up the great work
Greeting from sunny Athens
Hey,
I guess it depends on how people dress at the moment – how smart. I can see some men keeping their jacket on more or wearing a vest if they are cold, though both might be smarter than they’re now used to dressing.
On sweaters, absolutely. And all the better for it!
Hi Simon
This is gorgeous. As you say, interesting without being flashy.
On the sizing, I know you advise to look at the measurements (which are very helpful) but can you offer any additional advice? For example, in M/4, the 56.5cm (113) chest is smaller than the PWVC ventile mac (120) or your Wax Walker (116). For a coat with some flow this seems a little small, so I’m thinking to size up. Or is it more that it can be a little trim in the chest with space down the body? (I’m usually a PWVC 4, which to me often feels close to a large in other sizes.)
Also, have you written about having different colours in a wardrobe versus not? As I get older, I increasingly recognise that navy suits me and is something I’m comfortable in, so why purposely try to mix things up? (Question inspired by this coat plus watching the navy-clad Stanley Tucci in Italy last night!)
Thanks
Jamie
Hey Jamie,
I think a 4 sounds about right. The coat is a touch slimmer in the chest, but then runs in a slight A-line downwards, so I wouldn’t worry about a small difference there.
Interesting question on the second, no I haven’t. I guess a lot of the capsule pieces I do tend to focus on this – like how I circle around the cold/muted area a lot now, almost as a direct replacement for the navy/grey standard of business attire. But I can look at doing something on having a narrow wardrobe overall too
Thank you!
Simon, would you wear this version with lighter trousers, eg your Armoury or Rubato chinos (different styles, I know), or ecru denim? Thanks.
Yes, definitely. With my Rubato chinos and with ecru denim
Hi Simon.
Based on some of your responses that I’ve read to others, is it safe to say that the charcoal version is forever lost, never to be seen again..? Or is there still some hope left this season or next year?
Thank you!
No, I don’t think it will ever come back I’m afraid Mike
ahh okay that’s really sad.. same for the dark brown correct? I’m guessing then that the grey and perhaps this navy version might be the only ones around to stay for perhaps the next few years right?
There will be a small number of brown left over from the pre-order cloth and available at the end of this month
Are you expecting any grey herringbone to be available at the same time, Simon? The coats themselves, as opposed to the cloth.
Yes I am Richard. Those coats are also on the shop site now – though currently marked as sold out – so you can add yourself to the waiting list if you want first access
PWVC seem to have the grey herringbone back in stock – I’ve just ordered one!
Thanks Oliver. We will have ours available in a week or so
Hi Simon, I loved the colour of the Navy coat. However the collar seems to collapse as oppsopsite to the heavier brown verison I had,is there any chance to the cut of the collar ? Or perhaps it is the differences in weight of fabric?
There shouldn’t be any difference, no. However, the collar always naturally wants to sit down when you first get it, because it’s been hanging like that for a good while. The more you hang it with the collar up, and where it in that manner, the more it will want to stay there. Try keeping it hanging with the collar up and the top button fastened.
Hi Simon,
This looks great, well done!
comparing the 4 iterations you’ve done thus far (charcoal, brown, grey and navy), if you were to only add one to your existing wardrobe, which one will it be?
for someone who already have navy and grey overcoats, would you recommend this piece?
The first is really hard to say Brar – probably the navy or grey, but I really love the brown as well. Maybe the brown is best for you if you already have other coats in those colours? But it also depends how smart those are – what the overlap is
What about the charoal one? You don’t like it anymore? Or what role would it play amongst the four iteration? Thank you.
I like it a lot, I just wouldn’t put it at the top of my list.
In terms of role, it’s probably a smart option and one that works nicely if you already have a navy coat.
Would you pick the charcoal/brown/grey/navy donegal coat if you were to only have one single breasted coat or do you think it’s better off with a chesterfield or other sort of coat?
It depends how smartly you want to dress. I would certainly do that with several of those colours, but it’s partly a question of whether they are smart enough for your office for example
Received my coat yesterday and so pleased with the purchase and waiting for the navy version. The flecks are beautiful and the light ones are much more of a cream than what the pictures suggest. Bought a 4/M and very happy with the fit (181cm tall and lean build).
So, so lovely to hear Rickard, thank you
May I ask what are your chest measurements? Please describe the fit. I’m currently a Private White customer, this coat’s maker, and normally wear a size 5 in their jackets which fits me very well. I’m about your height and have a lean build as well. If our chest measurements are similar then, perhaps in this case the size 4 might be more appropriate.
I have a 39 inch chest. The coat is deliberately roomy, and I think you might find you can wear a 4, but a 5 could be more in proportion with the intended style. Have you compared the measurements to a coat you own?
Yes, and I concur with your assessment. My chest is 42.5 inches with a 34 inch waist. So from this prospective the 5 would work well, given that you designed the coat specifically to be roomy.
39 chest here as well and this is my first PWVC purchase so not sure about how this compares to their other offerings.
Since Simon mentioned how some people on the street casually complemented him on the coat I wanted to share that this also happened to me. The coat has just the right amount of additional interesting elements that sets it aside from the regular navy offerings that it is noticed in a good way.
How nice to hear. Thanks Rickard
Hi Simon, Before finding this review I asked Private White support about how much extra inlay there is in the back seam (in case I would need to alter the coat in the future) and the reply was that it’s just 1 cm. So I was wondering if the 4 cm allowance for the chest that you mention is incorrect or includes making alterations to the side seams as well.
Yes Eka, that’s the side seams
Hello Simon,
Hope all is well.
I was about to pull the trigger on the your/Private White’s light grey Donegal coat (called cream and white on Private White’s site — and still available in my size). My intention was to then find a nice navy double-breasted overcoat. My thinking was that would be me done for smart and smart/casual winter coats (for a while at least).
Then I saw your navy version and love that too. Do you think the navy is more versatile than the grey — in that the do you find it works better with suits, and so could be worn as my ‘office’ winter coat too? This would allow me to push out the DB overcoat purchase for a year — therefore staggering the costs and conversations with my wife when I have to justify a large purchase.
Perhaps the Donegal coats aren’t smart enough for full suit and tie, but when in the office I’m mainly wearing a sports coat and flannels in the winter anyway. Well at least for two of the three days I’m in now.
Sorry for the long message. Be great to hear your thoughts.
Best,
John
No worries John. To be honest I think that first option sounds good, but if you only want to get one this year, then the navy donegal sounds great too. And I think you’re right – not quite perfect with a suit and tie, but great with everything below that
Thanks Simon. Option one it is then ?.
Hey Simon,
Me again. So I bought the navy donegal in the end. It’s certainly a step up from any coat I’ve owned before. Beautiful.
Another sizing question, unfortunately. I went with size 5. I have broad shoulders and take a 52 EUR/42 UK jacket RTW/MTM — but have the waist taken in. My trouser waist is between a 48 or 50 EUR / 30 or 32 UK.
The 5 is perfect on my shoulders, chest and length (I’m 6ft 3 and 13st / 82kg) It does feels big and pretty roomy from the chest down. This made me consider downsizing to a 4, but I feel it’s more a matter of me getting used to and embracing the style. The coat feels very dramatic to me.
Would you agree that I should stick with the 5 based on my numbers above? I appreciate you can’t see me in the coat, but a steer in the right direction would be appreciated. And apologies for providing a full breakdown of my dimensions and weight — I’ve found previous comments by readers with their details helps make an informed choice though.
I think that definitely sounds like the right choice John, yes. Having seen several readers in the shop going through a similar exercise, I always recommended the larger of the two they tried on – it’s about the style of the coat
Simon, why do you say it’s a bit longer? Looking at the images, where should it end, in your opinion? To tell the truth, I think it’s a tad short (if we speak classic, not 2000-2020).
I know what you mean Jan, but it is still longer than most out there (I tried quite a few when originally doing the design). Also, bear in mind that I am above average height (just over six foot). I often lengthen mine by about 3cm, so give a length that is more classic, and between the knee and mid-calf.
That’s the kind of area you want to play in, I think. Below mid-calf looks very dramatic, but above knee looks like a car coat
May I ask if the different iterations of the coat currently available in the webshop (navy, grey, brown) are based on the same pattern (the latest navy one) and include the same seam allowances? I pose the question because the text under the navy coat says it can be lengthened by 5 cm (sleeves by 4 cm), while the text under the brown coat states 2 cm for both coat and sleeve length. Thanks!
Sorry Matt, yes they’re all the same, that text is just out of date. Thanks for pointing it out
Simon, I received this coat 2 days ago. It’s been hanging on my broad-shoulder IKEA coat hanger (the one that flares out on either side) and hanger bumps already developed! This is definitely a heavy, heavy coat, so do you recommend just storing them folded and flat? Which coat hanger would you recommend? How do you store yours?
Fantastic coat, so comfortable and I love it but my wife thinks I look very much like a Mafia boss or a slouchy homeless guy lol.
If you want to avoid that and it’s hanging for a long time, then perhaps, but those bumps will also drop out when you wear it. It’s not an issue I’ve ever had in that respect, I just hang mine.
In terms of style, try buttoning it differently. Eg only the second to top button, a hand in a pocket, that kind of thing. Even the top button as well if you want. It’s a bit of a blank canvas from a style point of view, if that makes sense – a fair bit is how you wear it. Unlike something that has more obvious style, like the bridge coat
Hello Simon, I am clearly in love with this coat, the only drawback I see is the weight of the fabric. At 800g, you are definitely in a winter coat in countries with harsh winters like the US, Canada or some Northern European countries. Moreover, if you wear a tweed jacket underneath, it can quickly become unwearable. Also, I find that the style of the coat is best suited for mid-season, that can be worn open like in the pictures. For the colder days, a double-breasted polo coat makes more sense to me (just my opinion). So, my question is, are you planning to make a version of this coat with a “lighter” fabric, maybe around 620g as it was in the beginning?
I know that the increase in fabric weight was requested by several people when the first version of the coat was released, but in the end, perhaps a more reasonable weight would suit more people.
Many thanks.
Thanks TB, but no no plans for anything lighter. I actually find the coat good for mid-seasons myself – I wear it from September into November or December here in the UK
Dear Simon! I am still figuring out what shoes to wear with my navy donegal coat when it is cold and wet. In your denim and sweatshirt outfit: would you wear your Viberg boots with this coat? (Colour and style)
Smarter boots are probably a slightly better fit with the coat, Alexander. I’d go with something like that if you could
How about this AI boot in very dark brown suede? Still too casual?https://angloitalian.com/collections/footwear/products/mountain-boots
About the colour of the shoes, especially when the top layer under the coat is also dark: My instinct is pointing towards black shoes (thinking about Gianluca M. explaining his black loafers when everything at the top is navy.) But I hope that dark enough brown could also do it. Your take? Thanks
No, that would be nice I think.
Yes, I think the instinct to go dark is right, but that can be a dark-brown suede as well
Hi, Simon
On the Rubato jeans did you took your regular size? Did they shrink after washing and how do you find the cut?
Thank you!
Yes I did. They feel a little snug at first, but they relax to be true to size. They didn’t shrink after washing, and I love the cut!
After the first weeks of wear I am sure this purchase was a good idea. Never had a real tweed garment, never had a raglan overcoat. I was surprised how soft a donegal tweed is, I expected something rougher. And most importantly, what I did not plan: the raglan is so useful over my daily tailoring. While my other overcoats are often annoying to put on over a jacket, this coat just falls over my jackets, without any need to adjust the layers. Really pleasant considering how often I have to put on and off my overcoat all day.
Amazing, thanks so much Alexander
Hi Simon, I hope all is well! Congratulations on another beautiful iteration of this coat. I have been enjoying last year’s version for a while now, and the fit and finish of the piece are really something. One quick question, I’ve noticed that unless I have the top button fastened, the collar tends to slowly fold down from the tips. Is there anything to do to “train” the collar to stand up better without that too button being fastened?
Hey Alex,
It will never stay perfectly erect on both sides – if it did, it couldn’t fold down naturally onto the shoulders. However, I find it makes a difference if I hang it with the collar up, even with that top button fastened
Many thanks Simon, I’ll give it a try!
I’ve had something of a mixed relationship with raglan overcoats. For many years I had a plain navy one, but I never found it to be particularly warm. It was good quality cloth and a decent weight. I came to the conclusion that the lack of warmth was partly due to the looseness of the design, so I eventually parted company with it. I acquired a couple of double-breasted coats (one good quality RTW, the other bespoke) which were much warmer, though a little formal. I decided that I needed a more casual coat and liked the idea of a tweed of some kind. I tried the PS ones but, as I think one or two other readers reported, I found myself between sizes. A size 4 didn’t feel comfortable around the shoulders, but the body was good. Size 5 felt comfortable around the shoulder, but too voluminous in the body. I was apprehensive about trying to slim it down so didn’t buy one. In the end, I bought a tweed Raglan from Crombie, shortly before they closed down. It was something of a compromise, with a slightly slimmer body, but a better fit around the shoulders. I think that was a false impression though and whilst the fit around the shoulders felt different, I’m not sure that it has actually been better and I’m still looking for a better alternative. I’m hoping to try the PS coat again and I’m on the waiting list for one of the versions. In the meantime, I’ve recently acquired a Harris Wharf boiled wool coat from Trunk that I absolutely love. It’s single breasted, but not Raglan-sleeved. That might suggest a more formal cut, but the cloth and it’s complete lack of structure (it’s basically a blanket with buttons!), as well as the colour (green) make it very casual. Although different in design, it’s probably more equivalent to your Stile Latino coat, Simon. I’m really pleased with it, especially as it cost less than £500. Highly recommended.
Thanks RT, all very useful.
Having seen many people try on the donegal in the shop recently, I’d say take the larger size. It’s meant to be roomy, to flow and drape. It might still not be you, but I wouldn’t go close or slim
Thanks, Simon. I agree, flow and drape are very much part of the design for the Raglan. I guess it’s a question of whether or not it’s a design that really works for me. I’m keen to try the PS again, though. I particularly like the dark grey tweed, so hopefully I’ll get to try one again at some point. In the meantime, I have a polo coat coming from The Anthology in a lovely taupe Loro Piana cloth.
Yes, I think you’re right RT. Hope you enjoy the Anthology coat
Sorry if this is a stupid question. What is the perfect sleeve length for a coat if your hands are by your side? (Sleeve length generated too many results on the website).
I had always assumed the wrist, but given coat sleeves can ride up depending on clothing underneath and position of the arm, I’m questioning my assumption.
Yes Alex, the classic is that it is long enough to cover the shirt cuff (so longer than a jacket sleeve) and even then, long enough such that the cuff is covered when you raise your arm (eg hold an umbrella). However not everyone wants it that long, so I’d say somewhere between that and covering the shirt when your arms are at your side
Hi Simon,
Would a size 3 small work for someone who wears a size 38 sports coats? Or would you go for a size 4?
Thanks
I would think a 3, but worth comparing the measurements to a coat you already have if you can – remembering that the donegal is meant to fit quite loosely
A size 4 on the fridge coat fits well even with a jacket underneath, but I hear that coat is more fitted. Do you think a 3 in this donegal coat would still work?
Thanks
It’s really hard to know John, it depends so much on body type and on style you like. Have you compared measurements to something else you own?
Hi Simon,
Is it possible to make the back vent longer? I like to have a longer back vent so was wondering if a good alterations company can do this?
No, not really. Sorry Andy
Hi Simon,
For someone who is 180cm, how far down below the bottom of the knee can the coat go? Is 10cm below the bottom of the knee too long? How far below the knee would it be ideal?
Thanks
I wouldn’t try and pin it down too precisely John. 10cm is quite a lot, but see what you think for yourself – try some coats on and consider the lengths. You’re looking to weigh up the drama and style of a longer coat, against something that looks like it swamps you. And of course length on a coat is not the hardest thing to alter, unlike a jacket
Hi Simon, are you considering another version of the navy Donegal for next year? I really like this one but fear the flecks might make it a bit loud… Thanks
To be honest I don’t find people think that in person, but I realise some people want something more conservative.
But no, we’re not planning a plain navy version for this Autumn
Hello Simon, I purchased this coat from Private White (just because duties and taxes are included there for international shipping). It is a beautiful overcoat and rich in detail and colour. In person, the Donegal fleck really is like a constellation. I am 186cm tall so the length is great and, our winters won’t be as severe, so I took a 6/XL, there’s enough room for a cardigan underneath or mid weight suit jacket with a 118cm chest circumference.
Very happy, thank you. Outstanding quality.
Amazing, thanks Rhys, that’s so nice to hear.
Out of interest, are you in the US? And so you bought from their website because you had the predictability of knowing what the taxes/duties would be, even though they could end up being higher or lower? It’s just useful information for the support team. Thank you
Hello Simon, I’m in Sydney. On their site, UK tax is deducted from the purchase price as I’m buying from overseas. However duties and Australian taxes are calculated in the end price which is a fixed amount over AUD$1000.00. They use DHL, which is seamless for Australia too, I think it’s a part of their integration. It’s just very easy, avoids delays and multiple charges.
Thank you Rhys, understood. So if you bought from the PS site, it would be the same except you would be charged the duties and taxes by the courier on arrival. That might even work out cheaper, but I understand the ease of having that charged in advance.
I think there is a retail move to pay the duty and taxes up front. Here in the NL, customers are very comfortable being doorstep ‘pin’ orientated (but it’s much less convenient now work from home has ended) but most of the uk retailers seem to be moving to payment upfront -and advertising the case.
But obviously, their prices have gone up to reflect this.As an example,the big uk shirt retailers now change in the region of 180 € (4 shirts) whereas pre-Brexit it was €110 with free postage.
I think it might be a little different in Europe, at least going on our experience. A lot of sellers were keen not to lose EU customers after Brexit, as before they didn’t have any of these issues, so many started doing DDP there to soften the blow.
I’m sure prices have gone up for a variety of reasons, but those DDP services certainly aren’t cheap – the one most big companies use, which also calculates your local currency price, costs 7% of the purchase price.
That’s correct. On another note, I wore the Navy Donegal today and it is a beauty, warm as toast too.
Nice!
Hi Simon,
I’m quite stuck between the navy and the grey, and would love to hear your thoughts. I wear dark suits with navy/black ties in conservative patterns/stripes to the office, and I’d imagine that’d be the bulk of my usage, but during the weekend it’s largely workwear. I currently have a navy raincoat, and a black DB coat. Which would you go for and why?
I’d go for the grey in that case. It bridges casual and formal a little bit better, and you already have something in navy (and black, not too far from a dark navy)