Dege & Skinner lightweight summer jacket: Review
This brown wool/silk/linen jacket was made in a lightweight model that Savile Row tailor Dege & Skinner introduced last year. It has a thin shoulder pad and no chest canvas, unlike their normal tailoring.
I can directly compare the difference, because the other piece Dege made me was a linen suit using their traditional structure.
Granted that was in an 11oz Irish linen, heavier than this 9oz from Caccioppoli (320156). But still, the difference is much greater than that, and importantly feels similar to any jacket from a Neapolitan tailor.
I wore the jacket last week at Pitti Uomo in Florence, where the temperature was 35 degrees (and felt hotter than that, given the airless valley the city sits in); it performed very well - not as cool as a short-sleeved linen shirt, but as good as any tailoring I’ve worn there.
In fact, there again I could make a direct comparison, because I commissioned the jacket to replace one that Biagio Granata made me three years ago. A lack of communication and some errors had made that jacket unwearable, but I loved the muted brown colour and slightly slubby texture of the cloth.
This Dege jacket felt just as light and breathable, so I can say with confidence that one reason Neapolitan tailoring has been so popular in recent years - its lightness in the heat - is now less exclusive. There is a Savile Row equivalent.
Of course, many will say that the Row should have done this earlier. Neapolitan bespoke tailoring started to become popular in the UK over 10 years ago, and a less structured jacket is not revolutionary. But still, we can be glad it’s here now.
The cut of the jacket remains very English: you don’t have the straight lapels or rounded fronts of a Neapolitan jacket. But I know there will be many readers that prefer this style.
It’s also worth noting that you do lose something of the English style by lessening the internal structure.
The layers of hand-padded canvas in a normal Savile Row suit give the jacket more 3D shape, with a firmer chest and sculpted shoulder. It’s inevitable that you lose that by taking out so many of the ways a coatmaker puts form into a garment.
But I feel Permanent Style readers are educated enough to weigh up these pros and cons. For me, I’d certainly go with this model if I knew a suit or jacket would be worn regularly in hotter European temperatures. If it wouldn’t be, the choice would be more marginal.
Dege’s head cutter Nicholas De’Ath has been talking to me about this lightweight project for a while, and I know it’s been through a few different permutations.
With my jacket, Nick originally put in an extra wedge of shoulder pad at the end of the shoulders, in order to lift the ends and reduce the effects of my sloping stature. But that made them look almost concave, to my eye, so we removed them.
There is still a small echo of that in the point of the right shoulder, and that’s something I’ll have Nick look at when I see him next. This was the jacket’s debut outing, and it was inevitable something would need a tweak.
(Before anyone asks no, I didn’t take straight up-and-down or front-back-and-sides shots of the jacket; the fit was not the point, and was always fundamentally good, given I had that existing pattern.)
The finishing on the jacket is beautiful, and this is something that Row tailors continue to do better than anyone in the south of Italy.
Regular readers will know how much more work it is to have a jacket unlined than lined, as lining can cover all manner of unfinished edges. Having every seam inside so precisely taped, as here, is attractively neat.
The overall outfit is very me, very tonal and unadorned.
At Pitti, it’s nice to wear something like this because you slip into the background. You can spend your time interviewing brands and makers with your clothes merely an elegant backdrop.
The trousers are a cream linen made by Whitcomb & Shaftesbury, in the slightly wider-leg style I wear most of the time at the moment (hem 20.5cm/8 inches).
The linen is 12/13oz from W Bill (60252), which holds a really beautiful, sharp line. The only problem is that it’s a little transparent, to the extent that you can see the pocket bags and inlay down the side seams.
I rather like this on the side seams - it almost makes them look like a dress trouser with grosgrain down the legs - but the linen is probably not the best for something like an office environment.
I also find linen that’s a little creamier is easier to wear, like the Holland & Sherry one I used for my Jean-Manuel Moreau suit. That’s currently not available, but I am working with H&S to try and bring it back.
The polo shirt is a sample for a new charcoal version of the PS Finest Polo. It does just about well enough under the still stiff collar of an English suit, although it will never stay quite as upright as a shirt.
The shoes are Sagan classics from Baudoin & Lange in black suede - my default for tailoring somewhere as hot as Florence.
And the glasses are the Californian model from EB Meyrowitz, in what they call amber mottle colour.
Dege & Skinner bespoke jackets are the same price, whether the lightweight or regular structure, which is £3800. Suits start at £5000.
Nick is in the US next from September 25 to October 12, in no less than 13 different cities. Contact Dege for details.
Photography: Jamie Ferguson
Beautiful jacket Simon.
My two questions are regarding the sunglasses:
1) How do you find they compare to the Starsky model, and are the Californian’s your new favourite?
2) I recall you chose the Hardy model from Meyrowitz to pair with tailoring, but it looks like the Californian’s may be just as suitable?
1) They’re larger than the Starsky, and probably suit my face a little more. However, sunglasses are also a lot about fashions, and larger sunglasses like these look a lot less unusual I think, which is often what I’m aiming for.
2) I think the Californian rounded style looks good here, but no I’d still say the Hardy is more versatile with tailoring.
My goodness. $1000 sunglasses. No wonder they take center stage. And held so carefully. I can be a quality snob with the best of them, but I’m on the back foot with that one. Congratulations on your success!
Yes, it is a lot for sunglasses, and I can definitely see an argument that it’s one of the areas where it’s not worth spending on a real luxury version.
But if you appreciate craft and budget isn’t as much of an issue, then that’s the price for handmade glasses from somewhere with a Mayfair shop and informed staff.
Hi Simon, apologies for dwelling on sunglasses on a jacket review! If i have understood correctly from past posts, your ‘Starksy’ sunglasses were fitted to your size (MTM, so to speak), ‘Hardy’ were RTW, and these were also RTW? Like you, i have a relatively narrow face, and it is remarkable that these models fit you so well, if they are indeed RTW. Thanks!
It’s more of a hybrid each time John. You pick a style you like and works for your face. But Meyrowitz then often remake or rework the frame, or indeed just part of it, so it fits you perfectly.
Here, for example, they remade the arm on one side because reshaping with heat was not enough to make them sit perfectly on my ears and on the bridge of my nose. With the Starsky there was remaking too, but with the Hardy just some reshaping.
With a lot of people this is what is needed with sunglasses – not bespoke or RTW but adjustments by a maker
Thanks Simon. That’s extremely interesting, and not something I had heard of before. Do you happen to know whether this reworking/manipulating is included in their service as standard? I will of course check with them.
I find glasses a tricky one. I had a pair made by General Eyewear, based on some adjustments to an existing design. However, I think I would need to have them make a further pair – refining a few points – for the fit /design to be closer to what I had hoped to achieve by going bespoke. I plan to have a pair made by Maison Bonnet for that reason; although the cost is higher, it seems the level of guidance/service they provide means that it is likely to get closer to an ideal fit. As you have discussed before, and as I am learning, the margin for error with eyewear is tiny.
Sincere thanks again.
I can’t remember actually. Certainly the manipulating of the frame with heat will be included – that’s pretty standard at makers, but many don’t do it very well, or frankly take too much attention on how the glasses fit. You only have to see how many wear glasses that they push up their nose the whole time, or where the bend in the arm doesn’t sit on top of their ears. It’s a shame really.
Remaking an arm might have been extra, sorry my memory’s failing.
Thanks again Simon, that’s extremely helpful.
Hi Simon, great outfit. The jacket looks very good, and they seem to have nailed this unstructured Style. Plus, it is such a pleasure to see finishing like this, it is One of those things that others don’t see but it is very rewarding for The owner. Nevertheless, even if it is not my jacket it makes me so happy to see it. The trousers look great as well. The Holland and sherry is heavier than this one? If it comes back, Will it BE available on the permanent Style shop? Also, when you were reffering to the wider fit, is it something that you are doing on all your trousers nowadays? Or you meant for your spring/summer trousers? And do they tapper ? From the images they seem to be cut straight, I quite like the cut on them.
Sorry for all the questions.
Thank you for your great job.
Yes, the trousers do still taper a little from the knee, and it’s for all my trousers. Not a big change, but then that’s what tailoring is about.
The Holland & Sherry is a bit lighter, and yes if we can do it it will be on the PS Shop.
How does the hem at 20.5cm/8 inches compare to your previous trouser preferences? And did you increase the width of the whole leg or just adjust the taper from the knee?
From the knee. It’s not that big a difference – my others have been 19 or 20
Funny you mention short sleeved linen shirts Simon… Did we see a sneak preview of the striped PS version at Pitti ? Is that still in the pipeline for this season ?
Good spot! Yes, that should be here in a week or so
Love an English cut on more casual fabrics like this one. How would you compare the structure, lightness and comfort in the heat of this jacket to the linen suit from G&H?
The Gieves had a little more structure, particularly in the shoulders. It felt almost as cool, but then it was very lightweight linen as well
The jacket looks great!
You said in the Biagio Granata review that the cloth would be better in a summer suit (and I think it was supposed to be a suit), yet you went for another jacket to replace that one in a realtively similar cloth – any reason you didnt go for the suit this time?
The colour looks a lot more subtle in the photos than on the Cacciopoli website. Do you find it easy to pair? Would it also go with a grey high-twist trouser?
Yes, I gradually changed my mind on that. I thought the material didn’t have enough texture for a jacket, but it does. It would also be a little flimsy for trousers.
It is fairly subtle, yes. It doesn’t go with a huge range of things, which is a definite disadvantge, but it’s great with cream and greys. The grey has to be pretty dark (like that Biagio outfit) or fairly light, just so it’s not too similar a tone to the jacket
Hi Simon, I like the fabric structure of the Jacket. Looks very refined!
1) Can you recommend any great sunglasses brands in the 300 Euro range?
2) Have you written an article of how your style has evolved over the years? I think your evolution from very classic to „relaxed“ classic, smart casual and sometimes casual well reflects the long term trend of the past 10 years or so …
I haven’t tried that many sunglasses brands I’m afraid, though Cubitts are pretty good.
No I haven’t written anything specifically like that on my evolving style, it’s more just covered in lots of other posts. But I can look at something if you think it would be interesting
Yes might be interesting to geht your general perspective on this. … and your thoughts combined in one article. Eg how has your Style involved within the classic range (eg lighter Jackets, different cuts and fabrics), why did you decide to wear casuals more often and whats the ratio now compared to 5 years ago, was it a conscious process or did it happen more on a subconscious level little by little? …
Thanks, good questions.
I would highly recommend Persol for sunglasses. Excellent quality and many great styles at around the £200/£300 price point. Another great article Simon
1. They’re not the best for support or longevity, but as a summer shoe I find they’re as good as most other dress shoes
3. Thanks. Glad that came through
The lack of structure makes a big difference to my eye. This jacket has a much more bulbous silhouette than the tobacco linen, which I really like. Are measurement the same with both jackets? Is there room to taper this one more at the waist?
I also strongly prefer the color of the fabric of that Granata jacket. Perhaps the photos here are more desaturated but this fabric looks more gray than brown, and gray is a bit drab for a summer jacket imo.
Interesting. Yes the measurements will be pretty much the same, and no I wouldn’t slim it more. Sounds like you like the effect of the stronger shoulder.
The cloths are the same – different pieces, but the same material. So maybe it’s just the photos
This is a lovely jacket. What are the buttons, Simon? They don’t look like standard brown horn.
They are. A darker shade, but the same unpolished horn I normally have
Beautiful colour cloth .
Are you able to put a link to it ?
Interesting you mention canvas, or the lack of .
I recently enquired about some RTW £1k jackets and was told they were half canvas .
At that price , having been ‘educated’ by PS , I expected full canvas but was informed that “half canvas…. made the jackets lighter and more free flowing in the seat “.
Any truth to this ?
Would you ever prefer half over full canvas, Simon ?
There is a link in the text near the top Robin.
There is an argument that a half canvas is lighter and therefore better in warm weather, but I don’t subscribe to it. You hardly lose any heat through the bottom of a jacket anyway, and it looks messy more easily. I’d always have fully canvassed in anything smart
Presumably the fusing, which runs the length of the jacket, would also make it less breathable and a tiny bit more insulating.
I’m assuming the whole canvas is floating, not fused. If it was fused then yes that could make a difference
Lovely jacket and outfit. Very much look forward to the charcoal version of the PS Polo.
I’d like to ask a couple of questions:
Over the past couple of years, I’ve had both trousers and a jacket made from 7oz wool/linen mix material and find them cooler and more comfortable than pure linen. I know you have written before on the merits of and your preference for wool/silk/linen mix for summer jackets. I would have thought that the sheen and warmth of silk would have reverse effect. Why do you prefer the three fabric mix over wool/linen?
And invisible socks or sockless?
Having the silk in there is just a style choice really – it gives a very slight sheen, which can be nice in a smarter jacket, a bit like the sheen of cashmere in winter.
I don’t find silk adds much warmth – it’s usually there for strength in a material that’s quite light and perhaps openly woven.
Always invisible socks.
Beautiful jacket and great to see somebody in the Row getting into softer tailoring.
Mark you, it’s expensive.
I would urge readers to take a look at Anglo-Italian’s bespoke offering.
They recently made me a jacket and the cloth, cut and quality of finish were excellent and it came in at about £2300
Thanks David, that is good for full bespoke. Was it in an AI cloth?
The cloth was Loro Piana.
I had 3 fittings and the fit for a first bespoke order was bang on.
Interesting. If that’s the price with VAT then they’ll find a lot of people wanting to try it.
I think based on website the current Bespoke pricing at AI is 2700 for a jacket.
The guys at AI are a pleasure to deal with and I’d say definitely worth a look if you’re interested in the house style.
Simon, you mention that the JMM linen is easier to wear because it is “creamier” – could you expand on what you mean by that? As in milkier/whiter? Or yellower?
And thank you so much for working with H&S to bring back the shade. Do you have a list somewhere of the various fabrics you’re bringing back? It’s such a fantastic aspect of the site, as with your Escorial tweeds effort, the oxfords and chambrays for shirts and so on.
I mean yellower, so not as bright and striking.
Thanks. There’s not really a list, it’s just that linen and the yellow tweed at the moment
Tried summer cream trousers once for a meet up with the guys in a restaurant for drinks. Needed to be conscious of what I sat on, leaned against, rubbing my hands on them, was it going to rain, brushing against cars in the parking lot, getting into/out of car, and of course eating/drinking stains. If I was wearing grey trousers I wouldn’t have thought twice about these things. Kind of unsettling.
Suppose I consider the scope of occasions to where them to be somewhat limited.
Note: I bought the PS Dartmoor sweater in cream about a year ago because I used the Navy and Grey constantly at work. Loved the look of the cream. Then promptly brushed a freshly polished shoe against the cream sweater leaving a faint but noticeable black streak on the arm. Haven’t even worn it once and it’s still sitting in my closet – don’t know how to fix it.
Now I’m eyeing the Fox Vintage Ecru flannel thinking – wow great contrast! Then remember that it’s cream. Ugh.
Yes that can be tough. I do think there are a few elements to it though.
First, that people are just less neat than they used to be. How many put a napkin across their lap when they’re eating, for example? That’ll cover the trousers.
Second, you have to accept cream will get little buffs and bits of dirt rubbing off. Not dark polish, but I think most of mine have had something on them that I have then dealt with appropriately (something else guys are pretty poor at) and after a clean later, you can just about see there was something there, but only if you look carefully.
Third, disasters definitely happen and it’s a reason not to spend a disproportionate amount of money on anything delicate (eg superfine suiting). Cream goes in that category
Very true, I have a pair of ecru jeans (the only pair I wear really) which have spent more time in the washing machine/hanged to dry than on my body. I seem to inevitably dirty them every time I wear them, be it rain, food, or even just dirt/dust etc.
Conversely, I have a linen ivory trouser that I had managed to keep perfect for almost an entire summer in the office. Then a morning I dropped some coffee on it, just a small splash mind you, but that never fully went away even after cleaning.
This has made me reconsider ever getting an ivory blazer/suite despite the inspiration from e.g. The Great Beauty (didn’t particularly like the film, but loved Attolini’s tailoring in it, though clearly very bold).
This is a beautiful jacket! Are there not any other tailors, A&S or Steven Hitchcock for example, that can make a similar type coat?
I haven’t heard them promote something similar, no, but I may have missed it.
Michael Browne does a make with very little pad, but I believe that has a more standard canvas. I’ll check. Usually tailors don’t want to give up that aspect of bespoke that comes from being able to create more shape with that internal structure.
At least in the past, Thom Sweeney would do a similarly unstructured jacket. I haven’t followed up with them in a number of years, but I would assume that they still do. Their style will be a bit different though.
Thanks Reuven, yes I wasn’t counting them because the style is a little different to most on the Row
A question on structure.
If ,let’s say, I’m going to a warm country, like Italy , mentioned in your article, (Pitti) temperature in the high 30’s, I decide on a structured jacket, can it be fully structured, even with a heavier fresco, eg Smith Finmeresco? What kind of lining also?
This may sound naive but can you please correct my terminology here Simon!!
Is it half, three quarter or full lining or canvas? I’ve forgotten which.
A jacket that has English structure I think you’ll find very hot in those temperatures. Particularly in a heavier fresco.
You can have it only half lined, basically with most of the back unlined, but it won’t make a big difference.
Is that what you meant to ask?
Simon, unlined jackets, with layering, and a top coat, are still a viable option for winter? Or do you need more structure?
I’m thinking that a softer structure is more appropriate for my work environment .
They can be absolutely fine, yes. You can even do them in a heavier tweed and they’ll be fine without a coat a lot of the time
Hi Simon, That answers my question well. Would a linen or hopsack jacket be much safer alternative for hotter climbs….. or Mock Leno…. don’t hear much about that fabric.
Many thanks again
On the fabric itself, there’s nothing wrong with fresco that you mentioned. You just might want one that isn’t too heavy.
On the structure, that’s going to be warmer no matter what the fabric is.
Jacket looks nice, soft, & easy.
Pardon me for asking on trousers instead of the jacket.
You mention that your trousers is transparent, isn’t that something common especially in very light color such as cream & white?
In your experience how do you deal with that transparent ? or is it just something that you should accept?
It is fairly common with a lightly coloured material that is also lightweight, yes, as it will often be woven quite openly. However, some are better than others, which is why I mentioned that H&S alternative on my Moreau suit.
I’m happy with it, but I know others wouldn’t like that look.
Hello Simon, your Edward Sexton Hollywood trousers don’t have that problem do they? Do you remember the details of the fabric?
They don’t, true. They’re more of a biscuity colour though and heavier.
All details on the article on them here.
It seems a little narrow in the shoulders, not necessarily in terms of fit but in terms of style and elegance. It makes your shoulders look very narrow and, as a result, your head look slightly out of proportion. At the end of the day, it’s your jacket and anyone else’s view is unimportant, but it would put me off buying this type of jacket from D&S.
I once read somewhere that you shouldn’t order fish in a steak restaurant. Is it a question of, perhaps, finding an Italian tailor to make a jacket like this, rather than a long-established English tailor ?
Thanks Chris. The shoulders are relatively wide, and wouldn’t be wider with a Neapolitan tailor, but certainly could seem small compared to something more structured.
I don’t think the point on who should make it is right, no. I think that would apply very well if you asked an English tailor to make a Neapolitan jacket – with their straight lapels, their curved open fronts and so on.
But that’s not the case here, it’s an English style and cut, with a lot less structure. You might not like the style, but I’d say it’s a different style, not a copy of another one, if that makes sense.
I like the greater focus in this article on suitability of the clothing / material for the weather.
For me tailoring is secondary to the primary purpose. E.g. there is no bad weather just inappropriate clothing. Although ultimately the tailoring is the distinctive factor.
Many years ago I bought a waxed linen Barbour jacket, which was not breathable and so was hot and sweaty in summer and too cold any other time. Neither use nor ornament, it looked attractive but there was never an occasion when it was wearable.
Whilst I appreciate your normal focus on style, tailoring, quality of workmanship etc. they are all important but redundant if the article does not function as clothing.
Cashmere I find too hot, roll neck jumpers are ruined by the slightest beard growth, Belts on coats always flop outside the car door and get filthy etc. etc..
I would not want you to lose your great opinions on style and tailoring, but I would like a little more of the emphasis on practicality you have shown in this article.
Thanks Neil, good point and noted
Simon, under the lighting, that jacket looks as much grey as brown. Great color for a sports coat. Which fabric do you prefer: this, or the H&S Dupioni silk that you recently had made up?
They’re rather different in look and feel. The other is slubbier, more unusual, less luxe. I love them both, but they’re different – I think it’s a fairly personal call which you would prefer
Yes, I didn’t realize just how slubby the Dupioni was until I saw it in person. I think I prefer the Caccioppoli for that reason.
I love it, looks lovely.
Any suggestion on underpants to wear with trousers like that? I commissioned a beautiful pair of trousers from Edward Sexton – the fabric is wonderful, but you can see dark and white undies through it and while skin coloured ones are available for the ladies, manufacturers don’t seem to make them for guys.
I’d just stick with white Russ. I find you can’t really see them much, and they’re the same as the pocket bags in that area too
Looks great snd Nick is the best. Made me an unstructured but lined the top quarter (his suggestion) and it is a dream
Great read as always Simon ,one thing that struck me was the materials ,the wool/silk/linen blend , sure it must have kept you fairly cool but I would imagine it would be pretty prone to wrinkling , especially when packing it for air travel.
How did you make it look it so good and un-creased in your photos did you iron it whilst out there or have somebody in Italy to iron it and how would you make sure it wouldn’t be damaged during the ironing process and the whole process wouldn’t shorten it’s lifespan the materials are quite delicate?
Actually Raj, it doesn’t wrinkle much at all – that’s the point of the wool/silk/linen mix. The wool is largely in there for its performance properties, like springing back and not creasing.
I folded the jacket in my luggage (as shown in this video) and then took it out the other end and hung it up. Then wore it the next day – and this is what it looked like.
Lovely jacket, cut and fabric. Perfect for Australia.
Beautiful jacket for sure and top end craftsmanship. But this time Simon I think it misses the score. I mean, a Neapolitan jacket must be not only light and unstructured but also bright in it’s color and “casual” in it’s making (a bit shorter, a bit rounded…) so to my eyes it is an hybrid not belongings to any of the two styles. And being it gray and worn over light coloured trousers (cream I suppose) accentuates what to my eyes is a crash. Understand me: it’s something I have seen many, many times from UK or USA people but I am a south Italian guy and my old ones taught me you wear cream, white or beige trousers only with some jacket’s palette (beige, brown, royal blue or even that sort of strawberry color), but always a bit brighter than gray.
Thanks, always great to have the point of view.
Personally I don’t wear bright coloured jackets that often, it’s just not my style, but even if I did I don’t personally feel there’s a necessary connection there with a particular cut. Perhaps it’s more a question of place and local culture.
I understand your point Simon and I agree it’s culture. But what I mean it’s also about the intrinsic nature of the garment . What we call a Neapolitan jacket is just a jacket made for the summers of southern places, places hot but also full of colors in that season. That’s why often such jackets have a brighter palette than the ones worn in winter., like to blend to the colorful background. Anyway I highly admire the way you deal with your readers and how you are ready to listen. Keep doing the good job!
Thanks Al. I don’t personally think there’s anything especially fitting about the style of jacket – it does not look out of place in the UK, in city or country really. But the colours might do
Lovely jacket. Is there much difference in coolness between the Sagans and the new unlined Belgravias? Would you wear the unlined Belgravias with hidden socks?
There is a difference, yes. Not a huge one, but if the weather is this hot I’d rather have the Sagans.
Yes I’d certainly wear the unlined Belgravias with hidden socks.
Hi Simon, the jacket looks great. It’s interesting to see how the market adapts and Savile row now offers a very lightweight unstructured jacket but with an English design.
I wondered why you chose patch pockets here but not for your linen Anderson and Shepherd jacket? Is there a design variation?
How does this jacket compare to the latest A&S linen? Does the extra structure in the A&S jacket make it significantly heavier?
I think those are probably best left to the piece on the A&S jacket if that’s OK, Noel
Certainly. So specific to this jacket, are D&S’s patch pockets somewhat smaller than traditional English designs?
Thanks. A little, but also in a lightweight fabric and a dark one like this they don’t look as bulky
The front of the jacket is superb — the fabric is wonderful – but the fitting from the back elevation is in question as it does not flatter you. I think it’s a bit tight from the waist down — perhaps a centre vent would have been more appropriate – or no vent.
The trousers are beautifully tailored, superb fabric – but as you are not wearing socks their lengh could have been a centimetre longer or more — the wider turn ups accentuate the the gap from your ankles to the shoes.
No belt? not sure – in a shade that matches the trouser. Some finessing might be needed – especially when you are not wearing the jacket.
I’d hesitate from judging the fit on the back, even if there were a clear shot of me standing still in the jacket, let alone moving.
A ventless jacket certainly doesn’t work very well functionally on me, and a centre vent wouldn’t really be right for something this elegant. More for Ivy jackets or hacking jackets.
I will wear the trousers with socks too, and of course with different shoes, but I’m not going to alter the length of them for all those combinations. A little compromise is always necessary.
On a belt, it would certainly add a nice extra detail, but I like how stripped back, simple and elegant this is. If I weren’t wearing the jacket I could untuck the polo and solve that issue perhaps. Also I’d really want to avoid a belt in this kind of heat if I could.
Hi Simon, this is a lovely combination. From the Loro Piana Mare collection, there is a wool silk linen swatch (N704033) which looks almost identical to the one you have. It is 250g with 71%wool 15%silk 14%linen. Would you know if there are of the same shade or which one is better for summer? Thanks!
I don’t know I’m afraid, I haven’t seen that one in person. From what I can see online it looks good, but I’d try and see it in person if you can. Or go for the same one as me
Hi Simon, looks wonderful. I’ve asked for something similar at lesser tailors and they all say you need a light fuse at the very least if you want to go for unstructured. Can I check if that’s the case here? Is there absolutely nothing in the chest other than the two layers of the linen? That greatly appeals to me and I might have to go back and tell them it is possible!
Well, first off, no one that’s actually a good tailor is going to be putting a layer of fusing down the front of their jacket. That’s a cheaper factory make.
But no, I think you’ve misunderstood on the structure of this jacket, which is my fault. There is no chest canvas in this jacket, but there is still a layer of body canvas running down the length of it – most English tailors use both, plus a layer of demette (felt). That’s why I call this is a lightweight jacket rather than a completely unstructured one.
On unstructured jackets, yes something with just this material would be pretty flimsy. Have a look here at more detail on materials for those types of jackets.
Perfect, thank you. Yes, these tailors recommended a light full body canvas and I asked if there was anything less – to which they said fusing in the chest if you absolutely insisted. Full lightweight body canvas sounds like the go. Thanks!
As far as I know and as weird as it seems, The Armoury uses lightweight fusing in their lightest jacket model, Mark Cho says so himself in the video where they presented it.
So maybe there is some truth in what Sam says?
Personally I like completely unconstructed jackets like Boglioli’s K-jacket (assuming that specific season isn’t too anemic in the lapels), but I haven’t tried the former in any case.
I’d be interested to know what precisely that referred to. Often fusing is used in unstructured jackets on the edges and hems for reinforcement and to keep them sharp. It’s different to using fusing through the chest of a jacket
The photos appear to have been taken at sunset. Pictures with better lighting would be great.
Thanks Henry. No, not sunset, just the shade on a very bright day in Florence. The sunlight would have been even worse!
Nice review. Just wondered if any canvas for this jacket?
Yes, there is a (very light) body canvas through the jacket, just not the chest canvas (horsehair) on top.
Thanks Simon. Out of interest, Is there a brand or name for this kind of light body canvas. What is make from? Possible to replace a normal hose hair Canvas suit with this light one?
Most makers offer a lightweight canvas as well as heavier ones. But no, you can’t really replace it- it would likely be cheaper to make a new jacket
Have you tried the sagan classic with rubber grip underneath? I find the leather sole version quite ungrippy, especially abroad where paving is less linear. As for the Sagan stride (thick rubber soles), do you find them a little clumsy looking to wear with tailoring?
Yes, I don’t like them with tailoring myself. But that rubber grip one’s are fine
May I ask concerning your latest preference of a wider leg opening: I must admit that the style looks often very elegant on other people (you included) that have the height to get away with it. I also lately tended towards 19-20 cm on my tailored trousers (although I am just 178 cm tall) and I like it. But with jeans I feel the wider opening makes my legs appear short, which is unflattering and annoying to me. I appreciate the look of jeans with a straight leg and a 20 cm+ leg opening on many examples I see from other people on the internet, but still when I put on my jeans that are comfortable in the thighs and with a strong taper from the knee down to a 18 cm (or even less) opening, I feel the taper gives the illusion of slimmer and therefore longer legs. I have muscular legs and small feet so this taper makes even more sense to me. Also for example I like to wear the hem of my ecru jeans rolled up quite high in the summer. In this context also a narrower opening is more compatible, I think. For some reason this taper is less important to my eye with tailored trousers, because they hang very differently, wearing over the calf socks is easier, and the less aggressive taper suits the elegant nature of those trousers (flannels or high-twists). Anything wrong with my reasoning there? Thank you!
I think that makes sense, particularly the last point about the difference between jeans and tailored trousers.
I would only say, make sure to look at the profile of the jeans in the mirror too, rather than just the front, to make sure you’re happy with the proportions overall, and the balance with your top half. I find often guys don’t look at themselves in profile or in total, and just look at the legs, and can look a little top heavy with very tapered jeans. But you’re clearly thinking along the right lines and can make your own mind up in that manner.
I’d lastly say, do consider how high you want to roll jeans. It’s not a great look if they’re very high, and definitely makes your legs look shorter.
Thank you! “rolled up quite high” means for me: Just high enough that the air/a breeze can get straight to my ankles, no more. I like to believe that this is still not fashion-victim-high. Cheers
Nice. As with the jeans, the important thing is just being aware of that potential
Do you have any experience with the cream linen from the Solbiati Art Du Lin book? Interested to know how they stack up in terms of opacity
I don’t, though it does look nice from what I’ve seen (in other colours)
Hi Simon – you don’t find it odd to wear short sleeves underneath a jacket? Thanks
I recognise that it has disadvantages in not having a cuff at the end of the sleeve, but I’m happy to give that up for a little coolness and the look when you take the jacket off.
As with all these things, it’s about dressing your way but with the awareness of why some people prefer other things – eg more conservative dressers insisting on long sleeves
By the way I do, both visually, but also (surprisingly to me) because I don’t find cupro on naked skin to be very pleasant, particularly in the heat. Sometimes it almost feels hotter than with a long sleeved shirts, though I am not sure why (I am guessing it might have to do with absorbing less perspiration away from the body?).
In any case, I’d much rather have unlined cotton in the bottom part of the sleeves, but no one actually does half-lined sleeves (and *very* few do fully unlined sleeves even in tailored jackets marketed as unconstructed and unlined).
This is where I suspect rollable, often unlined, cuffed jacket-substitues (e.g. a linen Teba) might finally shine.
In lack of said piece, what I have often done in the warmer months (not peak summer as I can’t beat to wear a jacket of any kind in 35-40C) is wear a linen long sleeved shirts and leave the cuffs unbuttoned. I find the higher intake of air actually makes a noticeable difference (in contrast, unbuttoning the jacket sleeves I find to be utterly pointless). However, yes, the fit of the shirt will be less precise obviously.
With long sleeve knitted dress shirts/polos, which usually have a soft/unlined cuff (meaning they will stay in place but also won’t retain weird folds afterwards), sometimes I fold the shirt cuff back onto and *over* the jacket sleeve, slightly, if length allows. Though that’s a bit of a look for sure.
It does look very nice Simon but personally I find wearing any jacket in hot temperatures to be very uncomfortable.Anything above the early twenties celcius sees me visibly wilting.
Putting that point to one side I do like the choice of linen trousers with Sagans.I have a pair of summer light grey trousers that just look way too formal for Sagans and look much more in tune with a pair of standard suede loafers.
Cheers Oggi. I think it is quite personal – different people deal with the heat differently. I’m fine in this, left open, up to 30. If it’s open there’s quite a lot of airflow
This looks great! I’m considering a lightweight suit (or at least a jacket) for next summer but can’t stretch to bespoke at the moment. Are there any particularly good places for lightweight made-to-measure tailoring in the UK or the rest of Europe?
I’d suggest Jean-Manuel Moreau or Saman Amel perhaps – have a look at our summary of all the MTM places I have reviewed though.
Excellent! Thank you very much.
Didn’t know where else to post this question and couldn’t think of a more qualified person to answer…
I had a suit commissioned pre covid and there havent been any fittings since 2019. They are now delivering the garment but my body shape has changed quite dramatically since then and it certainly won’t fit.
What would your advice be to address this? I fear it will be almost impossible to achieve a fit worthy of a bespoke garment.
Do you have any opportunity for a fitting to see what can be changed? Have you told them your body shape has changed that much?
Simon, very nice outfit!
I have a question concerning hot and humid climates, that unfortunately are becoming more frequent, and I feel that I miss information on what is not seen in the pictures; i.e. whether an undershirt is worn or not.
Have you ever investigated whether an undershirt + shirt provides better cooling than just the shirt? This would be great to know, in particular if you may need to go black tie in summer. Shall I add an undershirt for comfort or will it provoke additional perspiration.
In your website I found some articles concerning underwear (for instance Zimmerli), but no comments on how to use depending on climatic conditions. For sport activities underwear is indeed used even during the hotter days.
Thanks for the information that you make available in your site.
I don’t have any technical information on the matter, but I certainly wouldn’t wear an undershirt in order to be cooler.
A sleeved one is most commonly worn to absorb sweat, so this doesn’t show on the outer garment – at least they are in the US, much less elsewhere. But that doesn’t make you any cooler, it’s just useful if you sweat through your shirts a lot.
In other countries a vest-type undershirt is worn, but that’s also often for reasons of smartness, or not wanting to show one’s chest. In a more modern style, a vest like this does enable you to wear a shirt open, or deeply unbuttoned, and so create more airflow. But again, if the shirt is fastened at all, you’d be cooler without the undershirt.
I hope that’s helpful
I decided to re-visit this excellent post.
This is my question. I would be inclined to wear socks here, maybe the linen socks from Breciani or light cotton. What colours would go with cream trousers and black sagans?
It would be fun to have a sock article added to your superb wardrobe-building series at some stage.
Thanks Lindsay. I guess a wardrobe building one might be tough as it depends so much on what colours of trousers guys wear most.
I’d wear a light beige sock here – similar to the trouser colour, but not white as that can be rather bright
Super, thanks again.
Merry Christmas Simon. Please advise me whose cloth it is? (Jacket) and what’s the reference number? Regards Henry
It’s in the text Henry
Hi Simon, did you also find the jacket useful in London in terms of the lightness of the cloth during summer? Or was it too light? If so, do you think it would have been better if it were fully lined?
That would make a small difference, but yes it would make one. To be honest London has been so warm and changeable that no, I haven’t found it too light
Okay, so do you usually go for a half-lined or unlined jacket for this type of cloth?
I used to always go half lined, now I often go full, just because I’m not in a country where it’s that hot all the time, and the lining helps it sit better and so on
Aha right, thanks, Simon
Hi Simon. Love the colour of the cloth but I think it will be relatively hard to pair with anything else than cream trousers? What other trousers options have you tried and which would work well? Thx H
It’s mostly good with neutrals – so also grey, charcoal, black. But I have also worn it with a darker brown and a pale beige. With those latter too it all depends on the particular shade
Hi Simon, I am a bit frustrated that my newly commissioned jacket in this cloth has creases/folds around the chest. There are creases where each chest intersects with the armhole. Although I will see the tailor soon about this issue, I would like to ask your thoughts if you had similar personal experiences. I’ve noticed that this happens several times with other tailors as well even though I believe they are pretty reliable tailors as I found them after reading your reviews. Do you think lightweight cloth could be one of the contributing factors?
It’s so hard to tell remotely Jack – could you send me an image?
I have attached a photo below.
Sorry, I completely understand it would be very difficult for you to spot the issue just by looking at the photo. But as I mentioned the same issue happened several times with other tailors as well even with fairly straightforward cloths such as as mid-weight tweeds, so I thought it would be good to hear your thoughts so I could try to prevent this in the future.
We only had one fitting as it worked out well from the previous commission. So I don’t want to blame the tailor at all for this as it would be unfair on him.
It is hard to tell Jack. Neither of those look like obvious problems – they could be just a bit more drape in the chest, but it’s so hard to tell. Then again, even if it is just deliberate drape, it’s something you could ask not to have when something is being fitted.
It may also be an issue with you having a left shoulder that’s lower, and it being a fitting issue that could be better, but I hesitate to say so.
I actually thought it could be the drape as it is the tailor’s style to do that but could the drape be affected and more exaggerated depending on the type of cloth?
I have slightly dropped right shoulder on the right side and I mentioned this to him for this commission as a result I notice that there is certainly more pad on the dropped side.
The drape could be more noticeable with different cloths, yes.
On the dropped shoulder, the padding is there to align the two and make them look more the same, rather than to deal with the fit around the chest etc. Or at least it should be. If you’re happy for the shoulders to look different, it’s perfectly possible to cut the jacket to be cleaner and the same on both sides in the chest
Hi Simon, I just wanted to update you about the jacket. I went to see the tailor, and he suggested that he could remove the drape but warned me that the overall shape might no longer look as flattering as the chest and waistline would have a straight line rather than being V-shaped. He also thought that the lightness of the cloth contributed to the creases as they disappeared when I put my phone into the breast pocket. Finally, he ironed the chest areas to re-shape them, and the jacket now seems good!
Oh good, nice to hear Jack
I have two jackets from Caliendo with exactly the same problem. The issue isn’t drape but an armhole which is cut too high/close. I now use Ciardi who cuts a larger armhole and the fit is better.
If it is any comfort, the folds may soften slightly over time.
Hey Keith – that may well be the issue, and it’s one I’ve had on jackets, but I think it’s worth holding back from definitive answers based on just those images
I see, thanks for sharing your experience.
I also assumed the armholes could be an issue. I have another jacket from another tailor which had a similar problem, but this was resolved for my second jacket after lowering the armholes.
Have you managed to resolve the issue with the Caliendo jacket?
Simon, would you wear black linen trousers with this jacket as an alternative for a cream or charcoal? Many thanks Henry
Yes, that would be nice. A little unusual perhaps, and great for evening. I’d be inclined to wear cream on top perhaps as well, to soften the contrast with the black